YSK in the U.S., you can buy produce directly from black farmers and they will ship it to you. It can cost less than your supermarket and will piss off people in power.
1y 4mon ago by lemmy.world/u/FlyingSquid in youshouldknow from blackfarmersindex.com
Finding a farm close where you want is made unnecessarily difficult by the site’s interface. The grouping of states in regions is a hindrance and once you get to your state, the farms can’t be sorted other than by their name, so you have to look through every single one of them to find the farms close to you.
Great idea, terrible execution.
But probably not a difficult fix. Websites can be updated.
Which is why I’m providing feedback. I really want this to work.
Who are you providing it to? Because I don't think FlyingSquid made this website.
The great wide web. I don’t think it’s him either, but this is the channel I found.
I don't see a contact part on the website, but they do have Facebook, instagram and Twitter (X), those would probably be the best places to provide the feedback. And maybe you can add a message when donating?
I’m not not on fascist platforms but thank you for following up with options.
People who produce bad design like that, are often resistant to change.
Or they're inexperienced and don't know any better.
Or they might welcome assistance from someone who knows how to do it, since their expertise is in farming and they don't have a lot of money for web design. Such assistance could possibly qualify as a tax-deductible donation.
As a software developer making enterprise software, that simply isn’t true.
I have been responsible for making some pretty poor design choices and UX flows. I was never resistant to change and more just needed someone to say hey bro that’s dumb, I don’t why don’t we do it like this.
Now I know how to do X and won’t make the same mistakes again.
I've worked in IT for over 30 years. I have come across a lot of people who design terrible UIs and get all pissy when you suggest any improvements. I didn't in any way want to imply that everybody is like that.
Thanks for coming back to reply. First I want to say that the downvotes you’ve received have been unnecessary imo and I think I should have added that my original comment was in my experience and purely anecdotal.
I guess it all depends on the person and whether they see constructive criticism as… well constructive or whether they see it as a slight against them. Like in any industry really.
it's offended developers who have been forced to make awful UX/UI for sure. i had to change mine back to an upvote :)
I second this - though I agree that it definitely isn't universal. Especially given that I'm exactly the opposite - I welcome critique and improvements to anything I write because I love learning and improving.
If they are, you can probably make a better site, that adds the feature you're missing and can link to results on theirs.
Cmd-F or Ctrl-F to search for cities. It's imperfect, but I found seven hits for my city instantly. I could search neighboring cities and towns the same way.
To add to this comment, it's not hard to find any of this information. "States grouped into areas" scroll to find your state, or again ctrl+f. "Hard to find cities" thankfully living in my area and being somewhat familiar with said area I can scroll down the list and find farmers in my general area. Short of putting in my address and searching for 'closest to' which I hate anyway, this isn't as bad an interface as op suggests.
I'm still going to say it's just not great design; it presents you a large map that is not interactable in any way, then below that are bits of that map again with ordinary hyperlinks below for each state and/or region. Just let people click on the first map, or just ditch it entirely.
Once you've clicked on a state, you get a list of paragraph format entries sorted in the most useless way: alphabetically by business name.
Who is this website for?
I agree whole heartedly, it could be done better. I'm just saying it isn't complete garbage and if a little confusing still usable.
It's for the creator of the website, so they can virtue signal while producing something of dubious quality. Most of these farms are already discover-able on better, more comprehensive indexes.
Name one?
That assumes you know all the place names of the region where you’re at. Someone that moved recently and/or lives in a tristate area (all of which are in different state regions in my case according to that map) is just faced with a very hostile design.
at least you have something my state doesn't even have anything lmao, it goes to a boilerplate page that gives little info
My state (big ag state) has a whopping 3 and 2 of those are hemp. The one that isn’t just hemp doesn’t have an area listed, just the state.
I mean I’m glad there are any.. but yeah, not a super great resource for some areas lol
You could try researching CSAs in your area. There are a few near me that sell farm shares with weekly pickup of seasonal veggies during harvest season. I'm in northern California, and our rate is under $20 per week after we split it with another couple. We usually receive more veggies than we would buy during a weekly grocery store trip, plus our farm let's everyone pick fresh bouquets each pickup as a nice bonus.
I'd love to learn more about the ones in NorCal. I'm in the peninsula.
CSA huh
Yup, stands for community supported agriculture. They're often called co-ops or farm shares, but I think CSA is the industry term that you'll have most luck with when searching around online.
Farm co-ops I think focus on local farms.
Right but as far as I understand it the supermarkets and wholesalers screw all farmers over equally race isn't a consideration.
Completely fair - do you have a counterargument? I'd be interested in hearing the other side.
Constantly talking about race makes race a topical issue.
As in
- Not talking about race will solve the lingering systemic race issues, or
- There are no lingering systemic race issues, so we should stop talking about it?
Not OP, but keep seeing the world as if it is “us vs them” or “black vs white” or “right vs left” or “rich vs poor” will not help find common ground and compromises. There is no compromise for racism, but people putting more attention on it will only promote looking at the situation in a way where the difference matters.
Well b is definitely false, so I'm hoping they meant a
Oh no the US is a shitshow of systemic racism, like super ridiculous on every level. There is such a wild undercurrent, surface levek and then an even weirder like super liminal racism where it just has to be mentioned.
Watch like any late night and they will make a self depricating white person joke, middle aged white guy thing. Just stfu about all of it, address the systemic issues with actual actions and then just you know...live as neighbours as americans.
So the US is a shitshow of systemic racism but you want everyone to stop talking about race? Sounds like a way to never fix the problem.
Yeah I want everyone to stop thinking that making jokes about white people's potato salad being lacking in flavour and thinking it is 1. Funny and 2. Making any fucking difference other than highlighting differences. Black people can swim and have small dicks, white people can dance. The pop culture racism is boring and part of the problem.
Why are you talking about white people jokes when I'm talking about systemic oppression.
We were talking about systemic racism. A thing that ruins lives, not bad jokes.
You get how you can't solve racism without discussing race right?
Well for one, america has never shut up about racism and to go with that...things have not got better. It is literally legal to have slaves as long as you incarcerate them first.
Its like these people protesting at the moment, everyone is posting a catching sign. Why the fuck is everyone not just stopping work, just not participating? Because you cant monetise or grow your image that way. Americans want to be seen to care about race, to protest to blah blah blah. But when push comes to shove, ye vote for greed or complacency.
Things have not gotten better, seriously? Weird, I don't see KKK members hanging people from trees anymore...
Why isn't everyone just stopping work? You must have a great life, because a lot of people live pay check to pay check and are just trying to survive. Protesting by not working could make them miss rent and be on the street. Do you seriously not understand that concept?
The country was basically split on the vote and there was only 2 real options. What would you have suggested people did when it came time to vote? Throw their hands up and quit?
Things have not gotten better, seriously? Weird, I don't see KKK members hanging people from trees anymore...
Yeah...they just shoot up schools or use no knock warrants on the wrong house. Kill lads for carrying skittles or being out for a run. Sorry, the metbod has changed, that much is true.
Why isn't everyone just stopping work? You must have a great life, because a lot of people live pay check to pay check and are just trying to survive. Protesting by not working could make them miss rent and be on the street. Do you seriously not understand that concept?
Yeah I have a good life, precisely because we as a work force are engaged and act as one. We also have a non shithole country where you cant just be kicked out of your home, even if its for missing rent.
The country was basically split on the vote and there was only 2 real options. What would you have suggested people did when it came time to vote? Throw their hands up and quit
Be engaged and demand progressive politicians, not goplite. A third of america didnt even vote. Sppit down the middle with nazis, bleh and meh.
Jesus, so many bad faith arguments. The KKK hanging black people in trees is not even remotely related to school shootings. Jesus, you are reaching just to fit some crazy native you have in your head.
Demand progressive politicians? Ok, cool, and now come back to reality and what do we do when we demand those politicians and no one runs or they go unheard? Just cry and complain about how doomed we are? You want this make believe option that wasn't even a choice, and for everyone to really behind it. Wake up.
You're so full of hate and don't know how to process your emotions and this is what happens. You speculate wildly and make grand statements with no idea how they would even happen.
My comments werent to say the two were directly related, just that there are still instances of public murder in the US. I'm not at all full of hate, I just think the US is ridiculous with their passionate platitudes ( "This isnt Us") and then they elect nazis (it absolutely is ye) and still manage to feel superior.
The american exceptionalism has walked the population off a cliff because everyone was all too happy to be told how great they are instead of keeping up with global progress. See the below for a no exhaustive list:
infant mortality
Maternity leave
Employment rights
Incarcerated civilians
Incarcerated non civilians
National debt
Average lifespan
Number of billionaires
Number of homeless
...
I just think the US is ridiculous with their passionate platitudes ( "This isnt Us") and then they elect nazis (it absolutely is ye) and still manage to feel superior.
Well one problem would be thinking everyone in the US is the same. Not everyone voted for him, not everyone wants this.
Yes the US has a ton of problems, yes idiots are voting against their own self interest, but that's not what the country is comprised entirely of. A lot of people did the best they could given their situation, a lot of people didn't. But we can't paint them all with the same brush stroke.
I feel like we can at this stage, he was elected twice. The second time with greater support. All other branches have followed suit. The market leaders capitulate. Its great that AOC and Sanders exist but its hardly indicative of any greater shift in thenpolitical landscape...given the two party system has kept Sanders at arms length for decades and AOC has been brushed aside wherever possible.
Well if you think a leader being elected means everyone wants that leader then there's not much of a conversation to be had, because that's simply not true. Never has that been true throughout history.
Yeah yeah this is more of the same bs, "not my president". I never thought that, I don't think every NK supports Kim but relations should not be normalised while he is there.
Americans love slogans and this is the perfect out, rather than actually fucking engaging and making a difference. Too busy lapping up shit and thinking of funny signs to hold up at the next stop te genocide rally.
Wow, dismissive of people's efforts and non-stop insulting. Sounds like you're not just ignorant, but full of misguided hate. I'm doing with this nonsense, stay angry.
Im not at all angry, or hateful for that matter. It seems that was a fallback for you, and so many of your kind but Im neither of those things.
For decades people have spoken about America's growing fascism. For decades the people dismissed it. There you go, enjoy. Try not fuck the world on your way down.
Even if I was hateful, it would be far from misguided, the US is exactly as deserving of all the issues they are facing.
If racism still exists race still needs to be talked about....
Right. Its going so well for you guys so far, remind me again which breed of nazis are in power, and whicj programs they are focusing on destroying?
So you are going to act like everyone in America is the exact same. With the same views? Did you miss the election where roughly half of the country didn't want this or are you just lashing out because your stance was questioned.
Roughly half? How many didnt take part? Also, gicen its a shithole country, the election results do not relate to how many people wanted whatever. Lol democracy.
I still love how everyone acts like America is the only racist country on the planet.
We wanted to pretend it was ending ourselves until 2016.
Can't say I've ever seen people do that
TIL posting/having conversations about a characteristic of one country implies that you believe that no other countries have that same characteristic.
While I'm sure the fact that the dominance of US news and culture on the internet is probably really frustrating for non-Americans, it's pretty natural for Americans (or anyone, really) to talk about our own country and experiences... especially while having to grapple with how things have been escalating here. You're certainly free to share your own experiences.
Funny how I rarely hear about racism in other countries. Except when someone like me brings up that other countries are also extremely racist but it's been so normalized it's not newsworthy.
Or ask a European about their feelings on gypsies and watch them pull out some of the darkest shit you've ever heard.
What's really fun is that "gypsys" can refer to two entirely different groups of people, both hated out of pure bigotry.
I was originally gonna say Romani but then I remembered this very detail.
Europe is honestly just as if not more racist than the US
We just emigrated to the UK and my daughter is having trouble finding friends... she finally met a kid her age and the kid told her that the N-word isn't offensive in the UK.
Fucking what? (Yes, I know it is just as offensive here.)
And we lived in Indiana, the Middle Finger of the South, where the KKK was re-formed in the 1920s.
So now she has to start all over again finding friends. She was pretty upset and I don't blame her.
Depends ofc where you look, what country etc. And if you count people living here who themselves don’t count themselves as an European
While the EU acts more like one country than the US we are not a single country. So it vastly differentiates from country to country.
Asking people about gypsies will either bring out the worst or they will correct you and say that calling them Gypsies is like calling a black person Niger. Romani is the preferred term btw.
As long as they aren't assholes idc, I have had white/white-ish (if you consider Spain generally white, which some do and some don't lmao) "friends" that are way worse than gypsies or moroccans (which are other ones that are mentioned often).
I'm not entirely sure, what you're advocating for.
There are Turkish supermarkets, restaurants, döner stalls, and barbers all over the place.
I also know a Turkish electrician, but I'll go to him when I need an electrician, not when I need a Turk.
I would prefer knowing my money is going to people who have been systematically disadvantaged for this nation's entire history.
I suppose your post could imply other minorities could be included but the way I read your comment gives off big WLM energy.
Edit: spelling
NorthEast Florida has: https://www.melanatedgrowersinc.com/
Because they were kept poor, imprisoned, and abused until at least 1965. So the kids born in the 1950's had the first real chance to go to college. In reality though red lining continued right up into the 1980's, making sure black people couldn't get access to services and jobs because they were physically out of reach from the housing areas they had been pushed into decades prior. And job hiring racism still occurs to this day. It was in the 2010's they did a study with applications that differed only by having an "ethnic" name or a "white" name.
So until black people can access the same opportunities as white people there needs to be support. Everyone wants to assume this shit ended in 1865 or 1965 but not only did it not, it's still going on.
I'm just going to set aside the fact that this is your second reply to this comment.
Are you seriously suggesting the US is in danger of an Apartheid government perpetrated by Black Americans?
What are you paying for? Is someone forcing you to pay thousands of dollars a year to fund a scholarship or something?
And the reason they get help is because your parent's actions (not your grand parents) prevented black people your age from getting the same opportunities you got.
Dude you're the one who talked about the decisions your ancestors made. And literal pennies from your taxes to fund it.
The victim complex of so many white people is truly fucking wild.
Are you not already buying food anyway? No one is forcing you to do anything. But people are going to call you out for being so uninterested having an equitable society.
nice deflect. my actual point still stands, though.
Guy said he wanted to help people so have been and still are supposed and you took that as discrimination? I guess if we don't help everyone all at once we shouldn't help anyone?
And this would be a great approach if systemic racism didn't exist.
Everyone isn't treated the same, so helping them the same leaves people behind.
Pay for it? How are you paying for it?
Also there are programs that help non black poor people too. You seem like you're not educated on this topic lol
Nobody alive has lived through this nation’s entire history
Because they still get shut out of opportunities based solely on their skin color, names, and application photos. So they work together to create their own opportunities and are rightfully proud of that. America can stop worrying about race when we finally end racism.
Alright let's break this down Barney style. You have group A and group B. Group A decides to pelt Group B with oranges every time they leave their house. So Group B moves in together and buys communal umbrellas to live as unmolested as possible. And you think that is perpetuating Group A's conduct.
No I get it. Fox news screams reverse racism every time group B tries to go around the racist power structure instead of work inside it, and instead of critically examining that you've just accepted it as a truth.
Murdoch has news outlets in most of the world.
Do you have a recent example of someone who was denied an opportunity, that is afforded to everyone, based solely on their race?
2024 hiring link, PDF Warning, EDU domain
The studies go on and on. The sheet brigade may not march in your town anymore but they're still in positions of power pushing down on minorities.
I didn't doubt it's still happening somewhere; just curious how wide spread it is. I read the third link. It was interesting. I wasn't aware the Justice department spent almost 2.5 years going after lenders.
And the work still isn't done. This is happening all over the country.
Good resources and sharing.
I appreciate what you've done in the comments of this post.
Do you ever stop to consider that it may be exactly because of your obsession with the skin tone of people, that you have so much racism?
Try imagining being just as obsessed about eye colors. It seems ridiculous right?
It does seem ridiculous to me but I'm not racist and we tried that. In the 1980's and 1990's they made talking about race a social taboo. You just didn't talk about it. The only effect was to freeze racism in place while white people congratulated themselves on solving it because they didn't hear about it anymore.
So it turns out that in order to fight racism you have to talk about it and give financial support to the class that's been oppressed.
You get out of here you SOCIALIST. How dare you suggest we even the playing field for the people who we took opportunities away from for hundreds of years!
I know right? What's next, paying the kids we feed to the machines?
I am not saying you should just ignore it, or making it taboo. But Americans have gone to the very extreme version where skin-tone apparently has to determine who you are. It seems you have made it taboo not to define yourself by your skin-tone.
I truly do not understand how you cannot see the problems with that.
It is absolutely not taboo to define yourself otherwise, such as by your job, hobby, state, country, etc... but the reason skin tone racism is such a big thing is because that's what the racists use. Where in other countries it can be more about certain ethnicities regardless of skin color, in the US your skin color was enough to make you a slave or a free man and our racism is based on our slavery. We spent hundreds of years justifying skin based slavery and that pseudo science and twisted religion doesn't just go away like a light switch.
This is like, 50% the value of pissing off people in power.
It's because America is obsessed with race, and has systematically attempted to demolish black economic power from the foundation of the society, that people may choose to shop this way.
Intentionally buying from black owned businesses does not perpetuate a racist white man that is in a position of power that allows him to deny black people economic power.
Fighting racism with more racism.
This is why im gonna teach my future kids to bully white kids like I was, they need to understand /s I got them sent to juvie that was good enough for me lol, fight racism with the law, give them a criminal record and get them thrown out of school, way more satisfying
For context so mfs dont defend my old bullies they were 5 years older, would surround me and call me a terrorist (I was in 3rd grade) They eventually escalated and spat on my grandpa when he noticed them fking with me, he chased them and fell, and cops got called. They did this shit for like a month before anyone noticed, I was scared theyd actually beat me up if I told my parents. It was 5 white teens and one indian me, Idk any white kids that had to deal with that shit, I was being called a terrorist before I knew what it was.
That sucks man. But there are definitely white kids who got bullied badly, they just don't have the racism angle. I'm glad someone noticed it was happening to you. I went 5 years actively being bullied by the same kids and the schools decided it was my fault so they didn't even try to punish the bullies. They actually punished me for getting hit, even when I did nothing but curl into a ball, that was inciting them and grounds for detention. The school told my parents I was on drugs and made them get me tested. When I did do well academically I was accused of cheating and given artificially lower grades. The teachers made no secret of blaming me for being abused, I was routinely lectured for whatever other students did to me.
What was my crime? I did two years in a special education school because my hearing was impaired when I was younger. That was enough to brand me as chum in the shark tank for the next 5 years and an outcast for the next decade. And the only reason they stopped hitting me was because I grew enough muscles to make them hurt too.
like no ones gonna tell yall to go back to your own country typically, like I was born 2 miles away bitch this is my country
Yeah, im not saying no one else got bullied, mine was based around my race tho I had no choice in it, just post 9/11 america lol (you didnt have a choice either obv, but the argument is typically you cant be racist to white ppl or they dont face it the same way we do, ppl are still shitty for plenty of other reasons)
Yeah, racism sucks. I think I just felt like you were saying we couldn't have it bad but that's not rational and reading your comment back it's not what you were saying. There's very few places white people are going to face racism in America and a lot of white people don't realize that.
the democrats have built their entire brand around performative racial justice where everything they do is designed to appeal to different groups. Its super toxic and while I am vehemently anti-racist this tokenization of policy is counter productive and the reason why a lot of people reject the democrats as "racist"
I think this is downvoted because people don't realize the face of modern racism.
Americans always think they have the market cornered on everything. As if slavery and racism didn't exist until the 18th century.
"Can" cost less is doing a lot of work there. I would guess it would mildly annoy people in power, but TBH this isn't a way to save money. If it really was, it would be common practice already.
There are lots of people who frequent local / smaller farms for things like access to organic foods / rarer crops / community support, but I've never known it to be cheaper than the industrial produce one can get at your nearest supermarket. Supermarkets clobbered local guys for a reason and pricing was a huge part of that.
I would guess it would mildly annoy people in power, but TBH this isn't a way to save money. If it really was, it would be common practice already.
Bidets are a cheaper, well known, better way to clean your asshole after taking a shit, yet the common practice of Americans is still to choose to smear their own shit around their asshole with dry disposable paper cloths.
The flaw in your argument is that you think people, Americans at that, wouldn't ignorantly continue to pay more for the convenience of not having to think where to buy their produce, because they can get it from the local Walmart 15 minutes away, instead of saving $20+ and driving 2 more minutes.
Americans are notoriously lazy and stupid, as evidenced this past November.
I got one cause of how my friend put it to me when she told me to get one. She asked me "if you get shit on your hand, are you just gonna wipe it off with a paper towel and go about your day, or are you gonna wash your hands? Now when you take a crap, why are you just smearing it around instead of washing it?" And it stuck with me and I've bought bidets from then on out. A 12 pack of TP lasts me a year, and I only use it to dry my ass. It's the best thing in the world.
I laughed at friends and family during covid, cause I had a nice clean ass, and everyone else was fighting for toilet paper.
The crab speaks a deep truth.
Bidets aren’t common in a whole lot of countries. Heck there are probably more countries where a bidet is uncommon than common.
Can't speak to the cost, just found my local place and their FB link is offline.
a way to save money. If it really was, it would be common practice already.
I cannot overstate how dumb Americans are about shopping. The local Publix (expensive) just put the Winn Dixie (medium prices) out of business, because the Publix is newer and prettier.
Meanwhile, there are 8 other groceries that are cheaper than either. Even the Aldi isn't busy.
Been in a few big box stores lately, prices stunned me. "People pay for this shit?!" Dude on here posted his fish tank purchase. Spent loads buying: little rocks, sticks, big rocks. I just decorated a terrarium for nearly free.
I buy almost nothing new, hell, I find a lot of my stuff. We had to get a new washer and fridge last year, paid $400 for both off FB Marketplace, nicest I've ever had in life, minimum $2,200 at the hardware store. Not going to listen to Americans whine about high prices when they're complicit.
Apologies, you triggered my Rant Card.
As a fellow American, I can simplify this (Americanize it) even further.
I cannot overstate how dumb Americans are
about shopping.
Apologies, I'm just pissed off in general about my country, as I'm sure you are too.
American here. I love finding a good deal. My ex-wife, however, was put-off about buying used, she was more worried about how others saw her than actually saving money.
I'd pay more just to cut out corps.
My buddy's sister is a cheese monger. 10/10
My guess is it costs a lot more to ship small parcels of food rather than to transport food in bulk to one big store where everyone shops for it.
It would cost less for them to ship in bulk. It costs even less for them to charge you shipping and it's low enough for you that it's still cheaper than the profit cut of the distributor and grocery store.
It's cool, but buying produce from your neighbors is also cool. Strong communities thrive together
It’s cool, but buying produce from your neighbors is also cool.
Um... My neighbors are black you fucking prick.
Okay, buy produce from your black neighbors then.
Whats the problem?
My point was that the comment I replied to was a ridiculous false dichotomy.
I would really like an Imperfect Foods replacement. Originally, IF was scratch and dent ugly veggies on discount with some consignment items. Post covid, prices crept up and then you had to pick and choose to get a deal, but you could still get a good box for under $40 every 2 wks that also included things like farro and yogurt. Misfit Marketplace bought them out and it took on a Whole Foods by mail vibe. Double to triple the regular grocery store prices. It would be $80+/week for the same box content which is galling. And it’s not the groceries, it’s MM. Who is paying $3 for 1 cucumber? $4 for 2 apples? $8 for a single pound of grapes or a pint of blueberries?
New potential produce sources are most welcome.
I had to drop Imperfect Food as well from the same problems. It was just more expensive than I needed. I haven't found a replacement yet unfortunately. We are now just buying food as needed. I have been interested in a CSA but haven't done it yet
The unbagged produce was fresher than grocery store and didn’t rot on the shelf in 3 days like post COVID produce from the grocery store tends to do.
So this post has potential.
It's a bit sad that it's just the "black farmers". If possible, getting your stuff from a local market or even a farmer is always a good thing, no matter if it's a black or white farmer. I have that here in austria where I get most of my meat and cheese directly from the farmer and it's not just insanely tasty but also cheaper than from the grocery store.
Strong communities thrive together.
In Taiwan, we had "day markets" where local farmers and fishers sell produce directly to you from the previous day's harvest. Every city has at least a few dozen day markets as well. It really serves the community and not big corps.
Some veggies still have live bugs(ladybugs) on it. That's how fresh it is.
It also cost 1/4 the cost in a corporate grocery store.
We (the US) have farmers markets in a lot of places. They can have very specific times that I always forget about. Around here in the northern climate, the farmer markets stop during the winter or move indoors and shift to selling more jarred and canned goods. My neighborhood has a coop, but it's more expensive than the grocery store and with a worse selection. We have options here, but they require more thoughtfulness.
That was a culture shock for me when I moved to the US. I knew that back in the day, in rural areas of my country, the markets only opened once a week. I was shocked to find that happen in urban/suburban areas in the US. Back home I could just go to the closest market any day. Morning news would have a report comparing prices in different markets across the city, so you could pick the one that has the best price for what you need that day.
So every "farm" in my region is actually a community plot you can rent space in or a non profit outreach...no farms to purchase from.
Lots of deadlinks and farming alliances with mission statements.
Not a lot of links to buy food from farmers.
Yeah, this isn't being maintained. All the ones near me are dead websites.
My local link was dead but easy enough to find on FB. I'm going to drop by when I'm in town, see what they got.
Just Google "CSA <your city>"
Why are Americans so obsessed with skin colour
It's a nation founded on racism and the back of race based slavery. That shit doesn't disappear overnight, unfortunately.
Buying something because it goes to a certain skin colour promotes racism CMV
Don't cut yourself on all that edge before you graduate highschool kid.
The most impactful racism, that is also the hardest to fix, is systemic racism. I think the idea behind buying from black owned businesses is the individuals attempt to offset the systemic racism that they, individually, can do very little about.
it is still much more difficult for people of color to become professionally successful than it is for white people. That's a fact. There are still laws in place (and not nearly enough protections), which disproportionately harm POC.
Do they not deserve to be just as successful? To follow their dreams? To be able to support themselves and their families?
Knowing this, why wouldn't you seek out black-owned business to help counter systemic racism? Those in power in the US, at least, aren't going to do it. This is by their design.
I care about the well-being of everyone (well, minus the 1% and Nazis), but those who continue to be harmed by a system—that I directly benefit from as a white person—simply require more attention if we're ever going to have an equitable society.
Yeah that's not how it works.
CMV
Nah I'm good.
Which is a downstream effect of the racism the nation was founded on? Crazy right?
Sadly and unsurprisingly, nothing near me. On the bright side, we do have a farmer's market so I'll just continue to patron that and say that if you have one near you, definitely check them out!
Problem with farmers market is it costs farmers to have the stall there (rent the space), to move all their produce and they even need to man it. Which is bassically what a supermarket does, but in bulk so it's cheaper. In theory you would have to go directly to the farms for a discount.
Farm shops, so literally on the farm. Are also very expensive! The ones I see are usually targeting the middle class market so I don't really go there. I would go to a barn if it was cheaper than a supermarket
Honestly a shame with those farmers. Unfortunately why I had to include "in theory"
Stalls cost jack around here. $30 for the main market downtown, $20 at either flea market. Manning it ain't much when you have a family doing it for free and it's only on Saturday.
I've gone to farmer's markets and although the stuff is good, some of it is pricey. There are stuff like lettuce and stuff that are cheaper but most of stuff like berries and fruits are more expensive.
But on the bright side, that money (usually) goes right back into your local economy, instead of lining the pockets of some rich asshole from five states away who has a chain of grocery stores.
It does, as long as those farmers are giving back and trickling it down, sort to speak. It isn't the case for everyone, try not to buy from assholes if you can.
It's more expensive indeed, but I've found the quality is much better.
Definitely. 100% would rather buy from a farmer's market than a big name store. Also, around my area, the big farmer's markets are located in affluent areas
The market in my town delivers to my workplace every week. I order from them first, then supplement everything else from the grocery store.
To everybody saying "reverse racism" or whatever your wording is to imply that buying specifically from black people is problematic, why? Do you think that you would have a hard time finding a white run CSA to buy? This is just a resource for people interested in supporting the black community and frankly I see any form of opposition to it as pretty blatant racism itself. I'll return from a Google search with what I find for other race specified CSA indexes in a bit.
I'm back,
https://www.queerfarmernetwork.org/
Here's an LGBTQ farm share directory. Is it reverse bigotry to purchase from them? I had to play with search terms a bit but a combination of CSA, farm share, agriculture share, and your chosen identifier should produce you results.
I am genuinely looking for an answer because I'm fucking baffled by this thread.
Some sort of brigading going on here, lots of comments with almost identical wording.
buying specifically from black people is problematic, why?
The problem isn't that buying from black people is a problem, the problem is that it's trying to be a selling argument, and that's just stupid. Are the vegetables of a black farmer better than of a white farmer? Do queer farmers make better cheese than straight farmers? I somehow doubt it. In the end, it's a matter of skill and you can have that regardless of your sexuality or skin color.
I'm seriously wondering how you ever expect something like "inclusion" to happen when you're the ones that keep treating the groups you're trying to include differently.
To flip this argument... Are the vegetables from a black farmer worse than a white farmer? Do queer farmers make worse cheese than a straight farmer? I somehow doubt it. Therefore, if output is equal, maybe it's time to spread the love to these black and queer farmers.
You say, "in the end, it's a matter of skill and you can have that regardless of your sexuality or skin color"... and that sounds great, on it's face, but using that as your argument now, when, statistically, it's shown over and over again that skill is rarely the factor that matters, is disingenuous. When we, as a society, can get to a point where we can regularly show that, statistically, race and sexuality (or any other reason humanity chooses to use to make "others" out of our fellows) truly do not effect ones prosperity, then, and only then, would your statement hold any meaning.
if output is equal, maybe it’s time to spread the love to these black and queer farmers
Okay but why? What's the point exactly? Why discriminate against white farmers purely based on the color of their skin? Especially in the farming industry, both are doing an insanely tough job and they need people to buy their products. I think it's wrong to not buy from a local farmer because he's white and instead go to a black farmer that's 30 minutes away, for example.
If I'm living in a village and we have a white farmer, I buy there. If it's a black farmer, I buy there. And hell, I might buy from both if they have different products. Win-Win Situation.
This focus on skin color in literally every aspect of life is just getting really annoying.
You don't live in a village. You live in a nation with easy access to products and produce from boarder to boarder (until someone decides to mess that up). You're "local" farmer is easily both that white and that black farmer.
And if you're tired of the focus of things being on skin color or sexual orientation, even more of a reason to level out those statistics because, while those statistics continue to show a disparity of opportunity between White and POC/Queer individuals, you're damn right the focus should and will remain with the latter.
You don’t live in a village.
The 350 people in the austrian village I live in 80% of the time would disagree.
You’re “local” farmer is easily both that white and that black farmer
No. It's a white farmer. I meet him like 5 times a week.
you’re damn right the focus should and will remain with the latter.
Sad tbh, but you do you. I will continue to support my local community, because strong communities strive together, regardless of arbitrary properties that they can't influence.
In deed, man... If you fail to get it, that's you then.
It's about supporting marginalized people if one chooses to. If one chooses not to, they can just move one without comment. I'm just confused because it seems so simple and the only answer to me is deep seated, potentially non intentional racism.
The problem is that it's a fundamentally good idea to support your local farmers and businesses, but you're artificially injecting the race card yet again instead of just ignoring the skin color for once. It's someone who sells you carrots and potatoes, why care about the race? Why support especially a black farmer? There's no reason for it tbh - support your local business.
the only answer to me is deep seated, potentially non intentional racism.
Must be tough to try your hardest to see racism everywhere you go.
Not even an attempt to self reflect.
Nothing to self-reflect on since you and your american mindset are hellbent on seeing a race issue here. No reason to try and talk you out of it.
I rather not give people money by merit of the colour of their skin, though. Fuck me, right?
The fact that it's cheaper for you and they get paid more than the middle man would pay should be enough for you.
No one said fuck you lol
Yeah, that's not what's happening.
But keep playing the victim.
Well, only 2 within reasonable distance. One only sells microgreen kits. The other appears to be a supplier for restaurants, etc.
I zipped them an email to ask about private sales. But, definitely nothing on their website about sales and shipping to the public.
Thanks so much for this! I don't mind scrolling and clicking either.
+1 for this, it isn't that hard to do a little scrolling and if you really need it, use in-page searching and choose a city or town within your state.
Thank you! I did not know that. Last news that I heard about black farmers was about then getting screwed by massive ag conglomerates.
Im pretty happy to get an locally grown products. Im lucky though as we have lots of farmers markets and its not hard to sign up for a monthly box.
Here in Germany we have similar projects, but it seems the producers/farmers often have absolutely no idea how to anticipate or meet the demand of their customers.
Like, I'm very aware that farming is a seasonal business, you can't really grow much salad during the German winter without a greenhouse. Perfectly fine. What is not fine is dumping basically your entire salad harvest for that season in a 4 week window onto paying customers.
You'll get 8 salad heads per week for a month or two, almost inevitably throwing or giving most of it away, and then you'll get 5 kilos of some roots for the next 3 months.
Monthly box subscriptions have always been that though. You're getting whatever they can't shift.
It sorta works this way here. They try their best but there will be a lot of kale. They have this thing were you have some ability to substitute as well
Region 5; Ohio, Indiana, Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin. Why are Ohio and Wisconsin grouped with the same link?
I imagine for the same reason Iowa and Nebraska are on the same page. https://blackfarmersindex.com/reg-7-iowa-and-nebraska
Wisconsin and Nebraska have such a small list that they'd be a waste of a page, I guess.
I kind of figured that was the reason, but seems like such a weak reason.
How is this not racist? If there were a service where you could choose to buy directly from white farmers peoples would lose their minds
If the concern is economic disadvantages, shouldn’t the selectivity be based on income and net worth instead of skin color? Maybe selling products from poor and independent farmers. A portion of every race is economically disadvantaged.
Edit: I really appreciate your response. I think you described the issue really well.
shouldn’t the selectivity be based on income and net worth instead of skin color?
We should already be taxing proportional to income, and in the 60s when Affirmative Action was implemented, we were.
But the problem isn't just that there is a lower class at all, the problem is that the lower class is disproportionately filled with black people and minorities as a direct result of racism.
If you think of it like a footrace, we ran the first half of the race giving black people a straight up disadvantage for no other reason than the color of their skin. Now most of the people in the back of the pack are black. We should already be helping all people in back to catch up to the rest of the pack, but this still means black people are disproportionately in the back as a direct result of that initial disadvantage. We could ignore it, and say that after another 300-400 years of equality, maybe things will even out on their own, but in the meantime you have a bunch of people who are living in poverty and dying, and we can scientifically say for an absolute fact that it's a direct result of historical disadvantages targeting their ancestors based on race.
It's inhumane to look those people in the eye and say, "tough luck, we'd help, but we decided we don't do racism anymore."
So by buying milk from black farmers, you will help:
- many poor black people
- some rich black people
Whereas by buying milk from poor farmers, you will help:
- many poor black people
- some poor white people
How exactly is the former better than the latter?
Both are good. Each behaviour is a response to a different problem. Refer again to my footrace analogy.
There is a service to buy directly from white farmers. There's a bunch of them, including just going to the grocery store.
How is this meme relevant here? Who are the groups of people supposed to represent?
Black farmers weren't welcome in white corporations and co-ops. So they made their own. And now white people are mad.
Well why do you think it is? Genuinely curious
Because racism is the discrimination of someone based on their ethnicity. If you are choosing one person over another due solely to their ethnicity, isn’t that discrimination? Shouldn’t people be judged not by the color of their skin? Explicitly advertising that you are selective solely based on race is racism.
I have seen this discussion happen over and over again and a big part of the misunderstanding is some people in the US have the definition of racism also involving power and some don't. If your definition is the former, it's what allows people to say "Fuck white people" isn't racist with a straight face. Before you ask someone if something is racist, ask them what they think racism is. It will save a lot of time and aggravation for everyone.
Your comment made me think of this:
It doesn't matter what their definition of racism is. "Fuck white people" is racist.
To be clear, I'm 100% with you, just pointing out some troubles I had when discussing racism in the past and I found out we weren't all on the same page.
This is a remedial question, but that doesn't make it a bad question. It is a hard problem to solve, and calling an advantage based on race somehow not racist does sound paradoxical at first glance. It's important to be able to entertain the explanation without outright assuming you're being attacked by a bunch of obtuse racists.
Hopefully we agree that:
- black americans are at a statistically significant socioeconomic disadvantage compared to white americans, both historically and to this day, and
- this is a direct result of a history of systematic disadvantages specifically targeting them based on their race
Let's pretend the second bullet point has been solved, that systemic racism is over and done, and we've established a perfectly equal union. Even if that's the case, we are left with the first bullet point as an ongoing problem. The challenge is now, how do you undo the very apparent damage that our history of racism caused, without specifically giving advantages to that group based on their race? And the short answer to a very complex question is: you can't.
So the US government instituted "Affirmative Action" the goal of which was to deliberately give a targeted advantage to people who have had a history of targeted disadvantages in this country. This catches you up to roughly the 1960s.
But in the last 40 years or so, we continue to see lower class areas of the US disproportionately filled with black americans, and we also see widening wealth inequality affecting virtually everyone. So naturally we also see an increase of non-black people asking the same question as you: "I'm having a hard time too, why are they getting an advantage based on their race? That's racism!"
The solution was to tax the rich, reduce wealth inequality, and continue to normalize disproportionate demographics. Instead, the wealthy used populism to hijack the republican party, and convince white americans that the minorities recieving these benefits were their enemy. And after 40ish years of pushing this narrative, they succeeded.
With the republican takeover of the federal govt, we can be virtually assured that any ongoing attempts to normalize these unfair demographics will be abandoned, at least at the federal level.
But it's still a problem, just now one for the people and the states to solve. If you want to support black-owned farmers in an attempt to help pull historically disadvantaged groups out of poverty, you can. If not, that's fine, just at least please vote for legislation that intends to reduce wealth inequality. (Note that history has exactly two ways of reducing wealth inequality: high taxes on the rich, or war. The question isn't whether wealth will get redistributed, it's how).
Tl; dr Yeah, it's an advantage based on race to solve a problem caused by a history of disadvantages based on race.
Lol. Lmao.
I don't think this reads as what it was probably intended initially...
When people were hunter-gatherers and the world's population was about 100,000 humans in total?
C.S.A
Will it? What will eventually happen if this gains any sort of popularity is that those people you think it will piss off will simply set up their own "grass roots" alternative the directly competes with them by gaslighting them about their "horrible practices they don't want you to know", along with funding "white farmers against bullshit affirmative action racist against whites" types of movements as the cherry on top.
So no asian farms, no spanish farms, no middle eastern farms?
Why just black farms? Doesn't this lend itself to the trope of black people being farmhands?
Black farmers in the US have a particular history, what with chattel slavery and independent black farmers in particular being targeted for hostile takeovers and anti-competitive behavior from racists running big AG conglomerates in ways that other ethnic and cultural groups in the US have not faced.
We must stay divided or we might notice that we’re losing the class war.
This is the thing that I literally do not understand. Self-segregation is the stupidest shit.
A coalition of independent farmers or farmers with a specific agenda is much better than dividing shit by race. Race is the least meaningful way to divide people.
My wife is black, but she's not stereotypical American black. If she owned a farm she could be on this list... and she has zero roots in the historical american bullshit. She's literally an immigrant who pulls six figures in the corporate world. Most of the people of her cultural background are trump supporters for some stupid fucking reason (they think trump will only deport the "other" POCs, not their own, surely THEIR brown people are better right? Morons.)
If her trump loving copatriots registered as "black' farmers they could be included in this list... and by buying through them we'd be supporting the establishment no less than if we just went to a mega-corpo grocery store.
I'm all for supporting businesses and groups that are doing something positive for the community or at the very least are trying not to actively make things worse for people but blindly "buying black" is stupid. I'd much rather buy from a fucking worker owned co-op farm that is politically aligned as far away from hate as possible.
Owning a farm is not in any way the same as being farmhands.
www.squarespace.com
There ya go, you can make a site for each of those. Use promo code ImATroll for 0% off.
We'd be better off with a website that has farms owned by the workers that are also politically aligned away from hateful views.
Race based delineation is stupid.
I think we should come up with a term for the kind of people to whom the color of a person's skin is this important.
Do you think there might be a reason their skin color is relevant under the Trump administration?
Edit: Interestingly, your post history shows that you are very interested in skin color yourself.
I didn't see anything too egregious in their post history to get worked up over. Some downvotable opinions, sure (in America, a lifted truck is almost guaranteed to be indicative of racism, or at least republicanism.) but not really anything to be mad about.
I only went back 5 days, maybe that's a limitation for my mobile app, but yeah I also couldn't find cause to say they can't stop talking about race.
I'm not worked up over anything. I'm just noting that they bring up the subject of race multiple times in the couple of pages of their history I looked at.
It's a big subject at the moment. Palestinians v Israel, China v uyghurs, trump v everybody, it's not unreasonable to mention these things in context. According to their posts, it seems they're from Finland. I've never been, and don't pretend to know a whole lot about Finland other than their war with Russia and simo hayha (due to my US army background) but I would be surprised if I found out that Finland had an issue with race, honestly. So does talking about race during a time when race is a big world issue automatically make them racist? No, it's a discussion topic, and they never said anything racist. Don't press that button unnecessarily, or it becomes meaningless.
I never called anyone a racist. In fact, I was the one being called a racist for posting this in the first place.
Ehhhh you did go through their post history looking for something to be mad about because you disagreed with something they said. Neither of you have said anything racist. We need to remember who the bad people really are, those who do, or wish harm on others. Let's try consolidating instead of separating.
Again, I never called anyone a racist.
No, you didn't, but you definitely implied it.
Okay, well you clearly know what I meant better than I do, so I'll defer to the Flying Squid expert here.
Interestingly, your post history shows that you are very interested in skin color yourself.
Feel free to dig thru it and post it here for everyone to see.
That sounds like a silly thing to do when it's publicly available... and notable how often you want to talk about race.
I'll save them the trouble then and out myself here by posting the only other mention of skin color on my entire post history. Clearly I can't stop talking about race.
Concluding that someone is a lesser human because of their skin color seems just as illogical to me as calling someone a racist because they drive a lifted truck. These things are completely unrelated.
Who here is concluding that? Can you please present anyone here concluding that?
They're saying that quote is the only other instance of them talking about skin color in their post history, not that it's relevant to this thread or the people in it.
I think you are conflating where the “importance” has come from. A person can recognize that skin color does not matter. They can also recognize that the system they live in places a huge importance on skin color through endemic systems that have been in place for decades. How do you counteract an unbalanced system? By sticking your fingers in your ears and going “it doesn’t matter” or by seeking out those who are trying to make a change?
Unfortunately, for some folks it’s never enough. Why only black folks? Why not disabled folks? Why not indigenous folks? Etc. But you have to start somewhere - and many people aren’t even trying. My point is that projects like this are a start. They’re not going to solve every issue but they’re trying to make a difference and I think that’s neat.
I wouldn't agree with "sticking fingers in my ears and saying it doesn't matter" being a fair representation of what I'm trying to say here.
I would claim that in the case of person's skin color we truly shouldn't care about it any more than we care about the color of their hair or eyes. It's it’s a description of appearance, not a reflection of who they are. If we want to live in a world where this is the case, then my argument is that paying more attention to it is not the way to go. I'm sure the people behind this have good intentions but it's the method I disagree with here.
I apologize for implying that.
You’re right that we shouldn’t care, but how do we help those who have been disenfranchised if we don’t identify them? Advocacy isn’t about caring about appearance over character, it’s is about shining a light on systematically disenfranchised groups of people so that we can support them.
Despite what the Fascists would erase from history and science, critical race theory is like the theory of gravity, it's absolutely correct and all around us.
African Americans have never been made whole since their ancestors were brought here as slaves. They've never been the primary or equal beneficiaries of the generational windfalls that have occurred here. They've been sabotaged at every step. Ever heard of Tulsa?
It's ridiculous how many people shriek get over it when Jim Crow is still well in living memory. When African American families get substantial reparations for what was done to their families over and over generationally, so never, then you'd have a leg to stand on.
It's not about their skin color to me. It's more about a likeliness that they're not a Republican. Yes, I know, there are black Republicans, but it's less likely.
There is greater demonstration of community among non white people. As such, theres a built in hook not just for saying hello to a stranger, but for coming together to organize something like this. I think that’s more likely where it’s coming from than what you’re thinking.
Either way, I’d like a better veggie source for the things we don’t grow ourselves.
We do: "Republicans"
Anti-white nationalists? Or anti-MAGAts?
Just spitballin here...
5 day old account and you're posting like crazy all over the place.
Now where have I seen that type of behaviour before...
I didn't know that averaging 10 messages per day is considered "posting like crazy"
Lets hear your theory then about what that means.
Just don't buy meat directly - especially if you are hungry for bat and live in China.
Timely!
Ex-fucking-cuse me?
That's on point for him. He's as racist as the day is long.
I imagine his username is supposed to be ironic.
No, I'm positive it's literal, just like a college girl that says the same thing.