Peasants...
4mon 12d ago by lemmy.world/u/ekZepp in linuxmemes
Justified imo
Even 4s would be fine, anyone who’s made the move is better than anyone who’s stayed.
Even 4s would be fine
install finishes
"That was it?... Heh. Of course it was. This is Linux, afterall. Not some grotesque accumulation of defects for those base creatures."
Yeah honestly even if you try it and give it a fair chance but still decide to go back that’s fine with me.
In that case the user has made a choice is the good thing. They've seen what options are there and decided Windows fits their needs best. That's better in my mind than a world where everyone accepts the OS that comes preinstalled on their machine as permanent and doesn't consider alternatives.
Best part is that it never gets old day after day after day af...
Can confirm, I'm using arch btw and every three pacman -Syu 's I run into issues that are new to me
One day I will figure out what other Arch users do and why my installation had not a single issue in the 3 years it has been running so far.
I was thinking the same thing, I have installed it on a laptop and it's almost boring how it just works.
TBH, pacman aur is damn easier than managing PPA's on Ubuntu
Jup. I think I've had some 3 actual issues the past 2 years on EndeavourOS. But the Endeavour team did a good job of warning me on Discord/RSS or at least provide tutorials and explanations afterwards.
One of the issues was in regard to Grub (fixed by Timeshift rollback and a one-liner), one was in regard to some rogue Nvidia bug crashing the login window (fixed by Timeshift rollback and waiting a few days before updating again), and one was Nvidia removing support for GTX1000 cards and older (Nvidia, WHYYYYYYYY?!).
For reference, I had what felt like similar annoying bugs (and much worse) on Windows 10 about every month, but without any useful support from Microsoft. :(
EDIT: speaking of the devil. A fourth issue just popped up.
and one was Nvidia removing support for GTX1000 cards and older (Nvidia, WHYYYYYYYY?!).
Yeah this one REALLY sucked on my laptop still running a 960M. But hey, after the fix (which I think was just locking the driver package?) I just don't gotta worry anymore, so that's cool.
I don't get new issues all the time like op says, but I do have a few nagging issues that I'm too lazy to fix.
Usually it's graphics drivers going boom on update.
Yeah but that was communicated in Archnews: https://archlinux.org/news/nvidia-590-driver-drops-pascal-support-main-packages-switch-to-open-kernel-modules/
Sure the Arch or package maintainers could provide migration scripts for stuff like that (there probably are rolling distros who do that?) or when they split packages but usually you are fine if you read the announcements and act accordingly.
The question was how they make the arch go boom by running pacman -Syyu and I gave the most probable reason. Thanks for hitting me with RTFM
Sorry that wasn't meant like that, I was just pointing out that that was at least communicated in Archnews which not everything is, for example the firewalld package split you have to catch in the package update warnings which is easy to miss.
Yeah there's a lot of things you can do, but I bet most people just hit yes and go about their day, which is how they break their system. I've done it at least once (come back from vacation and pacman hits you with 300+ new packages), but also have broken arch by trying to install stuff by following old deprecated guides. It's not hard to break, but it's also very achievable to have a problem free time.
Heh, that's on you, bazzite here (was arch for a few years 4+ish years ago) can't remember the last time an update was problematic (oh, wait, 42->43 broke a distrobox, but I do that myself all the time, it's what they're for).
you know what distro I would choose if I were prone to tinkering at the expense of the system's month-to-month stability?
lmao :) Have fun.
It's been 9 years since I set my system up, so...
Please do.
On regular Fedora 42->43 broke (or forgot to change?) a few SE Linux rules for me, so that I got constant notifications about violations. Otherwise it's been rock solid so far.
Yeah, if you dig through journalctl (and you should once in a while) it gives you the commands to fix that stuff if you think it's right. That said, would be nice to not have to do that.
It's was even easier - KDE showed a notification, I clicked it and got a pop-up telling me about the violation and the commands to fix it of this behavior should be allowed. I could never copy&paste them from there. But yes, checking journalctl every once in a while is a good habit.
Since it was nothing that really prevented me from using the PC (e.g. virt-manager getting a violation when I shut down a VM), I reported it and waited for a bit if they'd resolve this and then just ran the commands after a two days without fix, because I wanted to get rid of the notifications
You get issues every fifteen minutes? Damn.
Just nuked my CachyOS install with a routine update and switched to Bazzite after repairing it in chroot failed. I enjoyed the entire process, even the failures.
I'm on arch now (BTW) and I'm eyeballing fedora atomic sway.
https://github.com/bradford-smith94/informant
This will help big time. 😏
nah, I visit archlinux.org before updating but most of the pain is self-inflicted
The progress in the last 2 years has been nothing short of amazing.
The KDE team, Wine, Proton, TKG/GE/etc have worked miracles for the Linux community.
Also, shout out to Microsoft for spectacularly face planting in their move to Windows 11/CoPilot/Vibe coded OS development. Nobody deserves more credit for Linux's growth than Microsoft's complete failure to innovate as an operating system developer.
The siren call of enshittification-driven short-term profits was too strong.
Little did we know that their long LONG term plan was actually "EmbraceIncompetence, ExtendBlueScreens, ExtinguishSelf"
Ikr? An indie game just came out last week, and I’m able to use my PS5 controller with all the really cool haptic feedback with no configuration on my end.
Well, I used enough linux to be angry about a lot of things.
And rightfully so.
/thread
4 days?
Took me 4 seconds to realize I can actually use the super key and have my start menu pop up instantly and not watch it struggle to load 50 ads and tell me to download candy crush
Just my files & programs, and instant search through them. All a menu needs to be
But also when I click the start button it has all of my files and programs
I have a couple of Linux machines, but I also use a MacBook. It's been a year now, and every time I use the Mac it kinda pisses me off that I have to hit Cmd+Space to bring up a search. It feels like a massive step backwards.
Well I know I'm superior because I don't use the OS that funds a pedo's STD collection via stock value.
I want that feeling to disappear, by having Linux completely dominate the OS space.
Microsoft Linux is what you want.
I think I threw up a little
Imagine Microsoft Office and Exchange Server being available for Microsoft Linux. Instead of WINE it ships with actual windows libraries as binary.
So instead of Windows Subsystem for Linux, you get Linux Subsystem for Windows.
Unfortunately, that's where I see it heading. And for all the good intentions out there, as soon as the corpos get involved, it goes to shit.
I think we're a few principled maintainers away from standard enshittification of the Linux Foundation.
Without the „corpos“ spending money on developing the Linux ecosystem, we wouldn’t be where we are today. Red Hat (systemd), Oracle, IBM made a lot possible. Apple took KHTML and turned it into WebKit, the browser engine bundled with GTK and Qt.
Google managed to capture Linux with Chromebooks and Android phones. However their spending benefited others as well.
Single maintainers can’t do much to stop a determined corporation with money from forking a component or writing a replacement. I remember how Debian maintainers spent immense amounts of time and energy into fighting about adoption of systemd to replace sysv init.
Then it will just be distros shitting on each other...
End Linux Racism!
The first few days is where you realize "holy shit, there is another world I've been ignoring and it's so much more fun."
I suppose it's a lot easier to have fun when you've got some stability.
I'm always somewhat confused by this, I haven't tried Linux since 2009 so maybe I just need to try it some more to appreciate what people mean by thks. I'd say it was "fun" in so much as it was nice to have a challenge for a little while but that was more sort of incidental to it facilitating my computer being a useful machine for me. In terms of it being a better operating system that does it's job efficiently without problems, shouldn't it be sort of... Invisible then? Like how can it be fun? I use my computer to do stuff so for me it's sort of like an operating system is only noticeable to the extent that it is bad and if it isn't bad I won't really be aware of it.
Well, invisible is how linux (mostly) is now, as opposed to windows which has become very visible and pushing and annoying by design. It is very refreshing to have an os which works and doesn't constantly annoy you with unwanted things.
You should try it again, I am pretty sure your experience will be very different from 2009, because a lot has happened to linux since then.
But see, doesn't that just mean it's a really good operating system? Not necessarily "fun"? I don't know if I'm getting my point across here. Think of a pair of shoes, there is much variation of form and design intent and pricing and capability but nevertheless they're pretty much all there to facilitate the task of walking. You could get a really bad pair of shoes that constantly dig holes in to your foot and fall to pieces and make walking a huge chore. Maybe some day someone will make a pair that somehow force you stop and look at billboards and ad displays, those would be your windows shoes. You could also get a great pair, that feels so comfortable you could forget you're even wearing them, they look great and they were a fantastic price and they never worsen your ability to perform the task of walking. They might even be such good shoes that they're suitable for all sorts of walking adjacent tasks like running as well, perhaps you'll enjoy running, again though what's fun there? Running? Or having shoes that don't make running difficult? I'd assume the former. That's what I tend to wonder about with the folks who talk about how much fun Linux is. I'm sure the various distros are really great operating systems that work way better than a lot of other options and don't have the same perverse incentives that keep those other options so consistently poor and for all those reasons it's a great choice but who's looking at operating systems thinking "this is going to be fun"? I'd love to have that same capacity to be so amused by it but it's hard to see it as anything other than a functional piece of equipment. I certainly will have preferences and appreciation for good equipment but I wouldn't think of it as fun. I have a similar reaction to people that say they like it because they want to tinker or "you can do anything you want with it", I don't want to yuk anyone's yum but, what would you even be trying to do with it?
"I’m always somewhat confused by this"
"I haven’t tried Linux since 2009"
ok
Like how can it be fun?
So many cool utilities are Linux native first, today.
When I finally switched my work computer to Linux, various little tools I had been using were suddenly trivial to install, instead of maybe an hour each. I had restored my full favorite toolset in less than 30 minutes, and moved on to exploring things that never worked on Windows, for me.
The combined feeling, for me, is like when my father user to hand me $5 to shop at our local 10¢ candy store. "I can just have as much of this as I want."
It's fun for enthusiasts only, I suppose
Back before I switched to linux it was how I (as a then Windows 2k user) looked at any version of Windows w/o the NT kernel. Now its how I look at people who still use Reddit.
Maybe I just like to look at people that way.
The few people I know that still use Reddit already used the Reddit app and the "new" interface before the API changes. I don't think they care too much to begin with (so yes, I also look at them that way)
Its more you are at the cutting edge where the general public will be in a few years. The only time I don't see that happening is when I think of the tildeverse as that is more an offshoot than a evolution of the tech landscape.
And rightfully so. They might not know much about Linux itself BUT they did dare try and for that they deserve recognition.
As they should.
Hell yeah!
It's their birth right
I installed Linux on my PC this week, so yeah.
Spill the beans! What distro are you running?
Simple and easy: Mint.
One of us! One of us!
Mint until someone makes a distro Karlach themed.
Be the change you want to see in the world
BTW?
I did the same for my home server. I've been Linux curious for over 20 years with very limited experience before I dropped my IT diploma. I went with Debian for pure stability and run xfce de.
Imagine being a Linux user and a vegan, it's absolute moral self-masturbation
Vegan Linux users can compile their own protein from source.
Their purity level is so high that they can kill -9 anyone wearing a leather belt with just a glance.
There's probably a pretty decent crossover between those two things.
I'm thinking about changing distros to Arch, for the animals (vegan btw)
Communist Linux users have a far superior morality complex.
Hey, some of us are also cyclists! By the way.
Which distro do you use tho?
I still look at Windows user like this after a year
If they didn't want to be looked down upon then they wouldn't be using inferiour software.
4 years later and I look down like I'm even higher up.
I had been dual booting bazzite for about a year, up until last weekend when it borked and I wound up just reinstalling. I just deleted everything and went pure linux. Still bazzite, still a little scared of the terminal, but windows is completely gone from my computer.
As it should be.
Every day I use windows I find more that is wrong with it...
Yes, let the hate flow through you.
Unironically me IRL. I switched to Bazzite from Win10 this year and it's been real smooth. I can't belive how easy the transition was.
Back in my day we had to manually install nvidia kernel modules. In the snow. Uphill both ways.
Steam? We had Wine launch scripts AND WE LOVED IT.
If our DXVK and Mesa versions were not compatible we just kernel panicked like a real OS. Kids these days with their GE-Proton and NTSYNC don't know how good they have it.
Kernel synchronization primitives? ABSOLUTELY NOT, we'll use file mutexes in userspace like Linus intended.
I like your funny words Linux man
I sed what I sed
I run Windows and still look at them like this
Mostly because they aren't competent enough to remove the bloat.
Yeah, but those with the competency to remove the bloat still get this look for not choosing the bloat-free option.
Competence will only get you so far in such a closed for.profit ecosystem.
knowing nod
Yes. I used to de-bloat Windows, myself.
The path ahead of you contains power...and freedom.
Ive been Linux only for 3 years and I gotta say, I still can't convince myself to move to a stable release. Opensuse tumbleweed is just on another level.
Updates, roll out!
Ma Man!
A fish of distinct tastes.
Woo! Tumbleweed is fantastic. I agree! I used to only do creative/productive stuff with it, but I finally moved all my gaming over a couple years ago and it's been handling everything I've thrown at it, on Nvidia! Whereas Win10 was bluescreening Vermintide 2 and saying "This app is too old :(" for my older games.
I think the only thing Tumbleweed wouldn't be great for, is capped Internet plans. X_X
Ive used it for 30 years... :)
I picture you:
Loved that guy! Need to rewatch xfiles...
I actually did rewatch it all a few years ago. Its quite good, but I see now as a older guy that David Duchovny actually wasnt very good playing Moulder. Didnt notice it as a kid but yeah, he is just reading lines with the same facial expression all the time. If you havent noticed, try rewatching with that in mind... :)
Gillian Anderson is amazing though, really good actress and she was paid much less than Moulder, despite being able to actually act properly.
he is just reading lines with the same facial expression all the time. If you havent noticed, try rewatching with that in mind… :)
That's basically Duchovny's whole range, as far as I can tell.
I think he was in some non-X-Files related movie. I never saw it, but I remember the commercial for it. Duchovny's character: "Are you here to kill me?" "Yes, are you worried?" "Just trying to plan my day." All deadpan.
I got so tired of X-Files stringing me along. It reminded me of some women that I tried to date. I gave up after the first movie (yeah, the one everyone forgets about) - no answers there, either!
I'm getting close to that point. I started playing with it in 1997 or 1998, trying to avoid grad school work... Daily driver at home for many, many years.
Ten years and I still look like that.
Helps that I have to use Windows at the office for a constant reminder of how shit it is.
Exactly. You can't even do arithmetic in the search tool of a computer. I just tried to change Win + C to open the calculator, and while it says I can pick any application, the list of applications is actually just copilot! So I can have their useless search, or copilot, or copilot. Great
There are a lot of "And rightfully so." comments here. And rightfully so.
I have been using Linux since almost 30 years. It took me almost a week to get X running, since it had to reboot to windows everytime I wanted to look something up or get help. Now I buy games on steam without checking if they run, because... they just do. :)
Actually I don't need more people using Linux, I am happy with how it is now - no need to attract the attention of the malware industry. 😜
I want everyone to have the benefit of Linux. It's not just about me. We'd then get those missing applications and drivers. And if anyone wanted to get away from the mainstream, there are distros just for that.
I don't think them and you will run the same Linux, but that's ok. Choice is good and kind of the point. :-)
You know, I have used DOS and various un*x (hpux, aix, irix, sunos/solaris, sco, bsd, minix, sVr4, others) in the 80s/90s, before linux and windows existed, so I'm looking at you like this, peasants!
/s :)
I played with FreeBSD, OpenBSD, NetBSD etc 25 years ago, but I am using Linux distro since early 00s, and now it is so easy to install/setup compared to the 00s!!!
I went to Linux at the beginning of the year and "had" to install windows onto a drive this past weekend, I've looked at myself this way in the mirror everyday since.
And after 30 years, same thing.
sudo systemctl reboot && systemctl deeznuts
I swapped back (250gb paritition on my 2nd internal ssd) for iracing and a few other nonsupported games. (and to do some initial hotas setup, moza updates, etc.) It's wild how slow windows is just in regular use, even opening the settings and clicking stuff takes 5 years while it's all snappy and fast on linux.
The only upside for windows is the few games not supported on linux work and I get 21:9 4k 180hz over hdmi, but im better off using 21:9 1440p 60 with my current dying gaming laptop that heats up way too fast. I play beamng and don't and it's stable around 50fps anyways, will swap to display port with my next pc so windows fr is only around for iracing and wrc, I wish more ppl would swap to push these games to support it.
To test a very stubborn program I had to install windows in a VM and use it for 20 minutes yesterday. It felt like I was swimming in a swamp located at the exit pipes of a factory that exclusively produce shit and deadly biohazard material.
Not going to lie, as a recent convert, this is not very off the mark. 😅 😎🐧
Meanwhile, people who've been using linux for 10+ years...
https://64.media.tumblr.com/13aa5f9a193fec7df0dbf39f654d4d82/tumblr_moatn8ntC31rp0vkjo1_500.gif
Is it porn?
No
The biggest issue I ran into when migrating was because I created an NTFS partition that I intended to share with my dual boot. So many programs had issues setting correct privileges on the folders or the privileges would reset after a reboot. Trying to find help was very difficult because I was doing something stupid to begin with. When I changed the partition to exFat or something else all my problems were solved. A couple of years later I maybe have booted into Windows 2 times total, I just use my work laptop when I need to run something that has issues with wine like the tax software
If your work laptop is a pain for those last Wine resistant apps: I recently started using (and liking) WinBoat for running Fusion 360, the 1 piece of software I can't get running in Wine and can't manage to switch off of. It makes it really easy to maintain a windows VM and then use RemoteApp to launch individual pieces of software from it as if they were running natively.
You are a live saver.
She keeps clicking on random shit.
Get an ad blocker on that browser.
Sounds like it's still quite a worry, maybe she's safe from malicious software but sounds very prone to being mislead in to doing things by bad actors through her computer.
Well done! You're doing important work, letting her chill instead of get scammed. Besides the money loss, many of those phone scams are also traumatizing.
Me after having control of system updates again when I switched to Linux.
Oh yeah can you put your taskbar or whatever on the side?
You can put your taskbar in the middle of the screen if you so desire!
i just want it on its own plate, not all mashed up with the look have you ever gotten your cake and your ice cream all melted together? we CANNOT LET OUR INTRUSIVE THOUGHTS WIN ON THIS ONE i do not want crumbs in my taskbar
😳 oh no a wrongful thought. maybe we can get him back to the right view if we give him more ai
Thats how i look at my former self
Been running cachy for a couple of weeks now, and after fucking up the setup once, second time was the charm
I love it
Effing things up is part of the process, I guess.
Especially when your first distro is literal goddamn Arch with a few bells and whistles
All hail King Torvalds! 🎺
To be fair took way to long to add Bluetooth to my Debian 13 laptop.
And rightfully so!
I do so while I order my servant to throw them some pennies.
I'm super happy with Debian, but I still have to dual boot because of Solidworks 😭. Also Elegoo Satelite doesn't work too good with Wine.
I've gotten solidworks to work in a Windows 11 VM with decent performance. I use Virtual Machine Manager, which is a GUI that uses QEMU/KVM on the backend.
I used this guide for better performance, and it also resolved an issue where solidworks wouldn't install because it could tell it was in a VM.
25H2 is Microsoft's latest major release, featuring a refined interface, faster performance, enhanced security, and better hardware support. It's the most polished Windows 11 experience, making it ideal for virtual machines.
This is either the biggest load of horse manure ever vomited or a scathing indictment of the true quality of MS product. Either way, i am glad i don't need those instructions.
Didn't even notice that bit lol. After reading lots of articles on the internet, one tends to skip all the BS in the intro. Can't disagree with that paragraph more.
I still think the rest of the guide is very good though, it walked me through tons of complicated config I could not have figured out on my own. Turns out you have to configure the VM to have special VirtIO hardware and install the drivers for that hardware within the Windows VM, among other various tweaks.
Also, this setup 100% should be people's last resort for running software on Linux. I would be using wine if I could, but the SolidWorks for Linux project has stalled in favor of the fusion360 for Linux project, so I had no choices other than installing Windows 11 on my old laptop or installing it in a VM.
Sweet, thanks so much!
I’ve been using OnShape for CAD. It runs in the browser and is pretty fantastic.
Depends on what you need to do and who you collaborate with of course.
I just do mechanical stuff. Does it do gear mates?
4 days? Try 10 minutes.
I mean... yeah.
The only thing stopping me from moving to Linux is the fact I want to play Battlefield 6 and Space Marine 2.
Space Marine 2 works just fine on Linux, I was just playing it last weekend. It has a gold rating on Protondb.
Kernel anticheat games can die in a fire, with all due respect to them.
I'll worry about them when I get through my backlog of games which grows faster than my completed game list.
I thought EasyAntiCheat didn't like Linux?
It didn't, but EAC added Linux support a while ago... so any game dev can choose enable Linux support (and most do in my experience). I play many EAC games on Arch(, btw) with an NVIDIA card, HDMI 2.1, HDR works, etc. I have a working VR (Index) setup, a gaming mouse with better customization software (imo) than Windows, etc.
Most of these things had various minor issues even a year ago and now the only thing I can think that is non-standard/requires tinkering is that I'm using beta drivers to have Vulkan support on NVIDIA. This provides a good HDR implementation. Once the Vulkan support is released in the official driver then a user could get all of the same features without ever needing to do anything but update their system and install Steam.
Progress in the Linux gaming space advances every week. Things are approaching perfect, outside of structural issues (such as kernel anticheat). I have 213 games in my Steam library and the only game that I cannot play is Apex: Legends.
Apex runs just fine, but EAC is configured to kick Linux clients if you try to connect to a match. This isn't a Linux issue that can be patched, this is a developer choosing to not allow Linux.
If you haven't tried gaming on Linux in a while, you should give it a shot. I've long since ditched Windows in order to have more free space.
It has support for Linux but developers need to enable it and it won't act as a kernel level anti-cheat like on Windows.
That's what dual booting is for!
I played Space Marine 2 on a steam deck. It wasn't the best experience but that was not because of linux.
4 full days??
Particularly Arch users
How me, still a Windows user then looked at fellow Windows users because i had planned installing Linux after 2 months.
@ekZepp LOL, that's the original Unix user, dmr, looking down!!
Hey that's me!
Kinda.
Was more like looking as an escapee at my fellow slaves from outside the fence, urging them to come escape too.