My younger brother keeps saying he is an Alpha male and bad mouths who he thinks are Beta. Can some one please explain to me what the hell is going on?
1y 5mon ago by lemmy.world/u/Patnou in explainlikeimfive
Your brother is on a (specifically designed and heavily funded) pipeline to being a total piece of shit (not just with misogyny, but racism, and probably queerphobia and ableism too), do what you can to get him off it. A quick search brings up what looks to be some good info to start you off:
Misogynistic influencers are trending right now. Defusing their message is a complex task
De-radicalising incels out of the ‘manosphere’ through Reddit
There are also many youtube videos on the subject, though I haven't watched any recently, so I won't link, but look up something along the lines of "manosphere right wing pipeline" and you should see some results.
The Alt-Right Playbook videos are an also must watch, starting here:
Fucking hell, I had to scroll all the way down here to find an answer that isn't complete garbage.
Good news, they're top comment, now!
"Alpha male" basically translates to toxic masculinity, and "beta male" basically translates to anyone who respects other people in any way. It's the callsign of pieces of shit like Andrew Tate, who is a human trafficker and serial sexual abuser currently in prison awaiting trial in... I think it was Croatia?
He doesn't know what it means to be cool, so he's hoping that just declaring that he's cool will be good enough to make him popular.
The problem is that the kids who try this strategy almost universally cannot pick up on social cues, otherwise they would understand that it will always lead to the opposite result. People who seriously say out loud that they're alpha males are pretty much exclusively losers or scumbags.
I think it was Croatia?
Romania?
Ask him if being an alpha male is a furry thing
Also if he likes werewolf romance novels
In this case, this should be the only acceptable explanation.
Skip a step and just buy him some furry romance novel like "alpha of my heart" or whatever (I will not be googling for options, no shame but I don't need that in my history)
Give it to him and tell him you support him and he's really brave to be himself in front of you and others.
Alpha males are like alpha versions of software
neutron male 😎
Tell him calling himself an alpha is just what a beta would do. Real alphas don't say shit about themselves, they have people who do that for them. Watch him implode.
"Any man who must say 'I am king' is no true king at all."
Im a Sugma male.
Not a Ligma male?
Or a Smegma male?
Ligma balls
That would probably just stop him from sharing. He would still keep consuming the harmful content
He’s watching toxic YouTubers like Joe Rogan and Andrew Tate.
If you want advice on how to handle this: ask questions. Ask them calmly and without any judgment. Be genuinely curious.
"What makes him a 'beta male?'"
"What characteristics do you admire most in 'alpha males?'"
"What characteristics do you think you have?"
"Where'd you learn about all this?"
Don't ask them in rapid fire, pepper a question in here and there over time.
Alternatively refer to him only as "Cuck" until he stops acting like a fuckwit.
No cuck shaming please.
What are they gonna do about it? Get someone to defend their kinks better than they can while they jerk off in the corner?
Dunno, but your fixation on defending the use of a kink as an insult soulds pretty assholeish. You do you.
Ok, in fairness the second comment was a dumb joke. But I fight stupid bigots with stupid bigotry. Its more entertaining for me than trying logic and reason because as we have seen time and time again from Trumpists it plain doesnt fucking work. Fuck them, if I have to be mad listening to their dribble, Im gonna make them madder.
Someone constantly spouting off about being an Alpha will hate a dismissive "shut up cuck" and being walked off on so much more than actually respecting their stance by arguing it with logic.
I also hate bigots, it's just that engaging in hate against non-bigots to go against bigots is unnecessary when there's tons of other ways to go against bigots.
I never said "don't insult the bigot pro alpha asshole". Please do, but please don't kink shame <3
Cucks are kinda into that though...
He wants girls to think he is cool but has received bad advice
It’s called the manosphere, and it’s a bunch of bad podcasters and YouTubers giving shitty advice on how to be a man to insecure kids. It’s annoying because it’s so stupid on its face and yet it’s working.
Can you blame them, though? I can’t think of a single person speaking for young men who is also widely accepted by the liberal left - or however you want to define the "good guys." Even here on Lemmy, anyone slightly deviating from the narrative is met with extreme hostility. It’s not that young men are naturally drawn to figures like Andrew Tate - they’re being pushed there.
What narrative would that be? That all people, regardless of gender, ethnicity etc. deserve equal rights?
What narrative would that be?
'you should'
"You disagree with our narrative? You must be a sexist racist then."
Thanks for illustrating my point.
If you disagree that all people should be equal then I won't treat you as an equal.
This doesn't require a ted talk. It's just fairness.
And why do you think I disagree with that?
I don't. I was simply restating what you said, but in a way that was less pointlessly confrontational.
It's pretty confrontational when you accuse me of something I've never said.
Where's the accusation? I simply stated a fact.
"If you're over 6 get tall you're taller than me" - I'm not accusing you of being tall.
"If you think bigoted things I'm going to treat you poorly" - also not an accusation. Just a fact.
That said, if you're feeling like it's an accusation, you might internally be worried that you are a bigot. But that's a problem for you and your subconscious to sort out. Nothing to do with me.
Do you not know what "if" means?
Ah there you go making assumptions again. Stop being a little bitch.
By refusing to answer my question you've given your answer.
Can you blame them, though? I can’t think of a single person speaking for young men who is also widely accepted by the liberal left - or however you want to define the "good guys."
There are plenty of social media personalities with massive followings that specifically aim some or all of their contents at men with a positive vision of what men can be. I watch FD Signifier personally. There are also plenty of articles showcase positive male social media personalities with millions of followers. You should have done a 5 second Google search before saying something so easily debunked. You can't think of them because you are not looking.
Even here on Lemmy, anyone slightly deviating from the narrative is met with extreme hostility.
Welcome to social media, first day? You'll get that same extreme hostility in Andrew Tates comments if you deviate from being misogynistic.
It’s not that young men are naturally drawn to figures like Andrew Tate - they’re being pushed there.
You're right, just not in the way you're claiming. They are being pushed by social media algorithms that reward toxicity and simple answers. That's not the fault of the lefts "groupthink" it's on those companies.
I just can’t take anyone seriously who refers to liberalism as “the liberal left.” Liberals absolutely have not treated young men well, but for fuck sakes man read a fucking book or something just once in your life.
I literally don't know how to describe the userbase of a platform like Lemmy any other way but maybe you can suggest me a better term then. I'm not talking about liberalism. I'm talking about a group of people.
'The left' 'leftists'
Liberalism, which is a centre right ideology if we’re using that idiotic left right scale, is fundamentally different from leftism and conflating the two is disingenuous at best and willfully ignorant at worst.
What's wrong about calling it liberal left then when literally 100% of those people are left wing leaning? Isn't that like saying "the conservative right"?
No, because liberals are not leftists.
How about the hundreds speaking to 'people' in general instead of young men? Making your target audience 14yo boys is kind of fucked up on its own.
Edit: as people habe pointed out, this comment is too generalized and not valid out of context. Of course there needs to be media for all ages. We should focus on limiting misuse in the form of indoctrination and manipulation.
This is an age group that does need guidance through, and it's looking for it, and if not provided with a positive role model will latch on to any that they can find.
As an example, look at "Gregory's Garden Goofballs" episode from Abbott Elementary. A group of the older kids start hanging out in Gregory's classroom because he's the "cool teacher" and he gets uncomfortable with it, especially when they start asking him advice about girls and because he doesn't have his free time anymore. But then he realizes this can be a good thing and that if they are hanging out with him and he's giving them advice, at least they are with a positive role model. So he sacrifices his free time to be the positive force for the older kids that aren't even his students, because otherwise they might gravitate to a less positive source.
Thank you for the positive comment. I agree that my initial comment was too hasty and I havent thought it through before posting. The real problem is not targeting teenagers per se, but rather trying to push an agenda by taking advantage of their insecurities
Making your target audience 14yo boys is kind of fucked up on its own.
Is it just me, or does that statement just not hold up to scrutiny? Are 14 year old boys supposed to just be complete pariahs from society? At what age does it start being unacceptable to address them, and at what age if any does it become okay to speak to males again? What do you expect a teenage boy's life to be like?
I'm increasingly convinced that being anti-man is a defining trait of being on The Left in America. The Left has no monopoly on progressive social issues. If you poll Americans on issues alone, they'll overwhelmingly come down in favor of progressive issues, things like higher minimum wages, medicare for all etc. The Left exists to play identity politics, largely against each other. Seeing men as the source of all their problems is the only uniting factor they share.
Depending on exactly who on The Left you ask, it is either a waste of time or outright immoral to talk to men and boys in good faith. The people posting about "Instead of gender reveal parties, you should have anti-heteronormativity lectures with rainbow cake" cannot stand the thought of saying to an adolescent boy "Here's how our social policies will benefit you." Because they cannot stand the thought of males benefiting from anything. That sentence sticks in their throat.
Most of my life I've heard "Girls need positive female role models in media." Is this somehow not true for boys as well? "Even if it is, it's not what we do here, and we'd rather it wasn't done anywhere else either."
Well it is being done somewhere else. There's a whole media empire out there who are perfectly happy to fill that niche. Nobody on The Left will even try to compete in that market because the culture war is too important to them.
Im not saying boys shouldnt be addressed and they shouldnt have role models. Im saying that people shouldnt target them specofically because they are young insecure men. Why cant people just consume media that fits them individually indenpendent of their age and gender? Why do we feel the need to shape people into roles they arent meant for just because of their gender? This is a leading cause of depression in young adults and it sgetting worse
Im saying that people shouldnt target them specofically because they are young insecure men
This is precisely why they SHOULD be targeted, why there should be programming and messaging specifically for them. They need mentoring and guidance through a strange, transitional period in their lives as they become the adults they will be for the rest of their lives. It's why sitcoms with a "family" or young adult audience often had those "very special" episodes in the 80's.
Why cant people just consume media that fits them individually indenpendent of their age and gender?
Yeah, why can't 5 year old girls just be happy watching Game of Thrones? Why should there be an entire industry devoted to making children's media when they could just watch what everyone else does?
Beyond that, this topic goes beyond entertainment. People turn to social media for everything from shortbread recipes to news to tax advice. And get this, this is probably going to be a new concept to a leftist: your demographics do indeed inform what you are interested in. There are topics, themes and messages that are relevant to 40 year old women that aren't relevant to 14 year old boys and vice versa. It's why we developed more than three TV channels.
Why do we feel the need to shape people into roles they arent meant for just because of their gender?
That's an extremely good question. Why should we treat every boy in the nation as if he was queer? That's what we're dancing around here, isn't it? "Heteronormativity" is a dirty word on the Left, after all, the idea of a "normal male" upbringing is seen as distasteful if not offensive. The idea of helping adolescent boys grow up to be straight men is a non-starter on the Left. So there are only right-wing voices speaking on that subject.
Thanks for your comment. I admit age-dependent media needs to exist to account for cognitive differences, of course a 5yo cant watch complicated content. I was being hasty with my comment.
For the rest of your comment, you are strawmanning so hard I cant even answer to that. I never said anything about sexual orientation and I dont know why you suddenly brought that up, we were talking about gender. Should I start talking about why you like Hitler? Just because someone has a left-leaning opinion on one topic doesnt mean they support whatever right-wing media are claiming leftism to be about. Noone wants to raise all kids as if they were queer, that is pure propaganda.
Okay look, the word "gender" has been so overused and misused at this point, it's like the words "patriarchy" and "woke" at this point. It means whatever you need it to mean right now to make the other person wrong. I'm pretty sure this notion of gender being anything other than another word for sex was invented on Tumblr some time in the last 8 years or so, it apparently doesn't refer to which kind of crotch you have or what you prefer to do with said crotch so...it refers to something that can't be measured or experienced about a person so it's a useless concept.
These people are no longer worth talking to or about. I leave them to their fate.
I dont know what youre on about. You are trying to make it sound like I am pushing some kind of gender agenda. We werent even talking about non-binary genders and I never brought that into the discussion, it was mainly about the male one.
I don’t know anyone who specifically targets that audience. There are those who talk about men’s issues (among other topics) and those who don’t, and the ones who do tend to lean more to the right and are almost universally labeled as bad people by everyone else. Even someone like Chris Williamson has mentioned how he couldn’t order merch for himself from a company in San Francisco because the staff refused the order simply because of who he is. I imagine Scott Galloway is treated more or less the same.
I dont know the people you mentioned so I cant comment on them specifically, but as I see it theres a huge difference between 'talking about mens issues' and indoctrinating them into mysoginists by saying stuff like 'bitches wont fuck you because you are weak and poor, you need to dominate them, thats what theyre attracted to'
liberal left
There is no such thing as a "liberal" left. Liberalism is a right-wing ideology - that's why they are constantly "reaching across the aisle" to their fascist brethren.
(Apart from that I do agree with your point, though.)
That just shows that one axis is too few to categorize political opinions. The opposite of liberal is authoritarian and while I definitely would say I'm a leftist, I'm not pro authoritarian.
Sadly, "liberal" partys nowadays are mostly economically liberal (i.e. freedom for corporations, deregulation etc.). But you can also be socially liberal, i.e. support individual freedom.
(N.B.: I'm not from the US, maybe the definition of liberalism taught in school here is different, or the literal translation is used differently)
The opposite of liberal is authoritarian
I'm afraid not. Liberalism is about as "authoritarian" as it gets - or do you classify the ongoing genocide the (so-called) "liberal democracies" are sponsoring in Palestine as (somehow) "non-authoritarian?"
Sadly, “liberal” partys nowadays are mostly economically liberal (i.e. freedom for corporations, deregulation etc.)
That is what they have ALWAYS been.
I’m not from the US
That doesn't matter. Liberalism is a right-wing ideology - even in Antarctica, on Mars, or on the other side of the galaxy.
Your brother is being recruited by the fascists. That is what is going on.
Andrew Tate and his cum dungeon brother are a big reason for this.
Beat his ass to establish dominance.
True solution, beat him into submission so that now he's the beta male and all of a sudden he's denying the concept
It's not important whether he believes in that nonsense, it's important that he knows he's the lesser brother.
Seduce his mom!
Anyone who has to vocalize that they're an alpha, isn't. Your brother is a loser.
If you have to say you're in charge, you're not
Nitpicking, but not every rule of nature. I still need to pee :(
He's just an alpha marking his territory.
Ask him,whether this alpha beta talk is a furry thing.
People are generally stupid, even more so when they're young. Younger people are getting brainwashed by low-IQ online influencers into believing this Alpha/Beta shit.
It's that simple.
If you want to help him, try to break his addiction to those influencers.
Did you seriously just do the same exact thing but with high vs low-iq? Was this irony intentional?
No. But I can see how someone obsessed with being obtuse as a hobby could benefit from implying that I was doing so.
Likes or death, amirite?
It's extra funny cause iq is just as much bullshit as alpha.
every metric for intelligence is bullshit to some degree or another. Yet, some people are actually dumber than others. IQ is a concise term that gets the point across, for the sake of communication, what more do you want?
IQ is a useful test when applied correctly. Using it on individual is rarely productive, but comparing population groups with similar cultural values is very useful. Two rural towns with a 10 point difference? Maybe the chemical plant down the road is doing something. Boomers being a few points lower then Millennials? Leaded gas.
Alpha quality, like software. Buggy as hell and should not be released. :D
srsly though it's the clusterfuckchild of social darwinism, grindset mentality and randroid zoology, plus a bit of wannabe-dom.
There was this old, debunked concept of the 'alpha wolf' as pack leader - all dominance displays, all the time, stronger and wiser and better than the rest, a sort of rightful-king that owes nothing to anyone, and that all lesser wolves obey and look up to.
Some absolute chuds picked up on the concept and decided that it applied to people, that it was a quality people could and should naturally embrace, unless they were just inherently inferior.
And of course they tied that all up with being male, because apparently men are just 'naturally dominant', unless again, they're broken and inferior ones - so if you are male, it's vital to prove that you're a properly functioning one by being a domineering asshole who deserves to get away with it out of sheer chutzpah, or else you deserve nothing but contempt and getting trodden on.
This ties in with conservative morality, which is entirely based around acknowledging and reinforcing social hierarchy. Right is when power is exerted downwards in the hierarchy, wrong is when power is asserted upwards.
So in this world, 'alphas' are the master race, while 'betas' are submissive half-men who lack the strength (and thus the virtue) to display the proper 'rugged independence'. They're also obsessed with 'cucks', ie cuckolds, men who lack the necessary manliness to fight off 'alphas' who would disrespect and shame them by having sex with their woman.
It's all incredibly toxic, and you need to pick him up and shake the bullshit out of him.
pic related
Get him off YouTube and social media
This is the right answer.
Toxic people that would never have had a platform for their bullshit have suddenly gained that ability in just 20 years time because of the internet. People that would normally receive a lot of fists in their face, do not anymore. The digital world is such a new thing that it's completely unnatural for us to live with and it affects our perspectives and social lives. It simply goes way too fast for evolution to catch up to.
Without good care, it creates people that are completely delusional and deranged. Filter bubbles also add up to the problem. One that consumes content will be served more similar content, creating and feeding a very limited perspective. Because everything in the digital world is so new, there have been almost no studies in how it affects us and how it should be remedied.
Your brother currently is a little loser who listens to the sad little men like Andrew Tate who talk about aloha and beta and have no fucking idea what they're talking about. He can be alright, he just needs to get out and touch grass, interact with real people, interact normally with girls... He'll be fine.
Just tell him that alpha and beta thing does not exist in the wild. Even the author said so.
https://phys.org/news/2021-04-wolf-dont-alpha-males-females.html
It does not apply to humans. Are you saying your brother is a wolf? Is he a furry perhaps?
Humans are more complex than that.
Yeah that argument has never dissuaded a single chud from embracing in the “alpha” bullshit. They’re being fed this bs from manosphere manipulators like Andrew Tate or someone adjacent or from peers. Their goal is to become cool and intimidating, it’s not about the bad research that lifted up this bullshit myth so long ago.
Also doesn't apply to wolves, the original researcher just mistook a parent protecting her kids for an aggressive male
He's defective. Talk to the manufacturer about getting a replacement
Young men who start to behave this way are lacking direction and aren't self-starters. So to cope with the fact they aren't accomplishing anything or going anywhere in life, they assume an outwardly-accusing posture.
Contrary to the image peddled by the grifters, every guy I've known with the "alpha" mentality has been a dishwasher, car porter, snow shoveler, or unemployed cretin.
Kick him in the nuts so hard you remove him from the gene pool permanently.
Andrew Tate.
You mean Gollum
yes
That tells you that he's insecure about himself
next time he says that just slap him hard. And ask him who's the alpha now?
All alpha maleism is categorically insecurity. For each of them it's different. Figure out exactly what he's trying to bury under all this tate shit and address it directly. It could be the onset of male loneliness, that shows up around the teenage years - lasts forever though if he's aware he can make changes. It could be he's insecure in his own sexuality - just get him to open up and take everything he said to the grave with you. There could be a person or activity the betas engage in that he can't, or is afraid of being made fun if. Teach him how to stand up to that shit and grow through it.
I'm not suggesting you punish your bro in a way that would enable this behavior further. It's hard to be an alpha type when you're showered in love and support- it just looks stupid. He's probably going through some of the first real life shit, and handling it poorly. As his sister you're kinda on the hook for helping him through this. If you do, you'd probably have a better brother and friend.
He found tate's channel.
I say this as a younger brother who was beat up by older siblings. If you are both under 18 and he's a lot smaller than you, slap him. If he thinks he's an "alpha" and you aren't, it might be the only thing that points out that he is just human
After you do this, please please please try to point out his error in thinking. No "alpha" commands any respect and the "alpha" bosses are the ones nobody wants to work for
"There is no such thing, if you want I can slap you around and prove you're just a normal person if you like?"
Avoids hitting anyone and hopefully gets the point across. If it doesn't... Wouldn't hitting them not get it across anyways?
Just tell him he's fully cuckpilled cause he clearly isn't looksmaxxing.
This comment section is either full of top notch satirists or the worst fucking people on Lemmy. I honestly can't tell.
Can't it be both?
He is a furry that identify as a wolf. /s
How old is he?
How old is your brother? If he is an early teenager, it is possible that he picked these concepts up from somewhere and will very likely grow out of that thinking all by himself.
Twenty Two. He just started this shit. Me and my mom don't know to be offened worried or what.
It's a furry thing
Yeah, ask him how many omega males he's fertilised.
Every time he says it ask him if that's a furry thing.
Re-educate him & show that Alphas don't live that long
NGL I called myself a bad dude as a teen. Said it to the wrong person and got ego-checked real hard in the face.
Let him know he's gonna get Alpha'd one day.
Sounds like the kids problem will solve itself someday
That or he won't, and will go on to create yet another one of those podcasts. The cycle continues. D:
That's... normal?
I know the streets are unkind which is precisely why I didn't get my face kicked in growing up. So no, that in particular is not news.
The underline issue is that human evolve to be part of social norms. Use to be a tribe, a country, a sport club. But new generation can be have more options. Associating with alpha male or whatever means he belong to a group who might like his meme or comments.
It could also be due to lack of a man figure they can associate with. So watching documentaries of strong males might help shed light on what the role could look like.
What you want is to balance his only identity or group with other (groups). For example, joining a gym, fishing, be part of musical band …. Whatever he is also into, just to get him out of that only identity he is associating with.
For me I would try to come from telling him being alpha means you can hunt or camp or survive in the wild, then lead to cooking classes or wood working. Something that mentally and physically taxing. I also would watch gordon Ramsay shows and Anthony Bourdain just to crash that image of one way to be an alpha male. You can cook and be an alpha male as the same time type thing.
Yeah he needs Ron Swanson
"prove your brother wrong," is a valid solution.
I don't think you really get the underlying issue here based on your response.
Do brothers not wrestle anymore? Lmfao
If you're really asking what it means, an Alpha is a strong leader. They don't take commands, they give them. If they want something, they take it. They consider themselves superior to the weaker beta males, and feel that it is their duty to lead the betas, or that they are doing them a favor by pushing them to be more like an alpha.
Although, a lot of the time, the people who claim to be alphas have none of the redeeming characteristics, so they just act like entitled assholes.
EDIT. I think because I didn't come out swinging people are assuming I believe any of this shit. I was trying to explain it from the perspective of their brother. I thought they wanted to know what it was about, and just calling people assholes doesn't really explain what THEY believe.
Correction - when you say "an alpha is a strong leader," you mean, "some people think an 'alpha male' is a strong leader, but that's not based in reality."
If you’re really asking what it means, an Alpha is a
pseudo scientific myth that has been twisted and then adopted almost exclusively by toxic men to try and boost their own ego and justify their shit behaviour
FTFY
I wouldn't even give it that much credit.
The surest way to guarantee you're a beta is by calling yourself an alpha
Alpha and beta? I'm released on service pack 2
Tell him you aren't interested in hearing about his omegaverse self insert
Others have given you a lot of info here on what it is your brother is referring to.
But what this is reflecting in your brother is that he has fallen into a pipeline of watching these videos or hanging out with people that watch these videos and had some insecurities that he's dealing with that is making these ideas seem like the answer. It would be a great idea to be supportive of him in whatever other hobbies/activities he has outside of watching those videos and spending time with him. Talk with him about anything other than the content of those videos so that those thoughts aren't even entering his mind. Introduce him to your friends that are also supportive in something other than those videos (you don't mention your ages, so it's unclear if you know the same people). Having supportive people around his activities and hobbies will help him lose some of those insecurities that made him gravitate to those videos.
If that fails, what I've seen others say works is if says he's an alpha male say back "I'm not into that furry stuff, but that's really cool your so open with your sexuality like that, and accepting of others' sexualities like recognizing the beta males"
If that fails, what I’ve seen others say works is if says he’s an alpha male say back “I’m not into that furry stuff, but that’s really cool your so open with your sexuality like that, and accepting of others’ sexualities like recognizing the beta males”
I doubt that actually works to get people off that mindset. It's just a funny twitter joke people have latched onto. Other than that 100% agreed. If he's fallen into this manosphere shit things probably aren't going well for him socially and he probably needs help to get out of it. When I was young I certainly did and was fortunate enough to get into a much better environment after I got out of high school that corrected my mindset (for the most part, there's always a need for self-reflection). While deserved, ridiculing him for these beliefs won't get anywhere other than to make him feel more isolated.
Anyone who calls themselves an "alpha" anything is a small dicked nobody.
How old is your brother?
kick him in the ribs, become the true alpha
You got opportunity here to tame him, ask him what makes one alpha?, then convince him that you are one or at least superior than him. Then, you will unlock ability to demand more share in things like food and money. But he looks like person who just argues.
He's a beta cuck. Real alphas don't have to go around proclaiming their alpha status and receiving praise and validation from betas and other "alphas".
And you're telling everyone here that you are an ableist.. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
nope, autists don't need that flack
That's Based
You're very confrontational. Don't lie.