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What's the biggest misconception you think many people have?

20d 8h ago by lemmy.world/u/Return_of_Chippy in asklemmy

Ideally the answers aren't just political soapboxing.

That the world is a zero sum game. That in order to have something, someone else has to go without. That in order to be great you have to drag others down.

It's the driver for misogyny, homophobia, racism, xenophobia, and so much else.

A lot of those aren't necessarily a "zero sum game" strategy and more of just that many people are genuinely judgemental, ignorant piles of shit.

It's a mix of things! Many racists don't think of themselves as racist and primarily worry about actions to empower minorities because of the zero sum thinking, not so much because it's helping "the wrong people"

Exactly. If we could lose that somehow the world would be so much nicer to live in.

It has been my experience that, if you could identify these people, they are the best to avoid. Excising these people from your life can very quickly prove it.

Capitalism is worse. It's literally Monopoly. We've all played that shitty fucking game. With capitalism you get perpetual inflation. A negative sum game. A zero sum game at least implies some basic conservation mechanics, perhaps even a fairness. A negative sum game is a total debt based economy. Waste is a feature. Disposability and commodities go together like peas and carrots, and that ethos sadly reverberates across ecosystems until the planet is dead but you got those pounds or dollars or pesos or whatever. Can't eat them. Can't really do Jack shit with them.

The rich gonna wake up some day soon and find the farmer has a well oiled rifle. They'll make rich fertilizer.... 🤑

Yeah I agree that isn't true

These people must fail to understand how consensual sex works

Probably never had it

People tend to assume if someone is smart in one thing, they're smart with everything else too.

That's not usually the case.

And also assuming that someone who's not smart in one area is not smart in any area.

Good point I like that answer. Conflating knowledge on a specific topic with general intelligence.

Similarly, people who assume that anyone who struggles with English as a second+ language is an idiot

This one always surprised me

Yup this is me and my dad, he's great with handy work and has built numerous homes. I am good with technology and can build a server and make my own software. Put us in opposite roles and were both dumbasses.

Or if they are rich, they must be smart or a genius, because they got rich while everyone else did not, its further from the truth, since most of these people come from wealth to begin with. adjacent, same goes for these succesful youtubers/streamers/influencers, these top ones we see all the time dint come from rags to riches, they came from being rich or very well off.

Sure, but without this flaw engineers wouldn’t have any personality at all.

I can differ 17 different kinds of glue by taste!

This effect was described by Dunning and Kruger.

High price = high quality.

The luxury pricing model has totally enveloped markets at this point and the correlation rarely applies now.

Absolutely. I’ve learned over the years that it usually works out pretty well to find out how much the cheapest dogshit option is and aim for an option roughly 1.5x the cost. Obviously not a blanket rule but it covers a surprising amount of common items and I’ve gotten plenty of long-lasting affordable alternatives that I actually enjoy using rather than having the crappiest version of everything.

Yeah I look for the cheapest option and go a step or two higer

Depends on what it is but as a general rule to start from it isn't a terrible idea.

Veg I will go cheapest because I don't care if a carrot has a curve. Cooking equipment I usually go midrange and try to find out WHY the really expensive ones are better, then look for those specific features if they actually matter.

My bike is quite a bit higher, though there is a very wide range for bikes. I went for the cheapest of the high end bike range at £600. Probably spent close to than in accessories and maintenance by now too. Although some maintenance costs are me buying tools I didn't have before too.

As much as I'm laughing at people spending more than $50 on a kettle or toaster or toothbrush or what have you and calling themselves clever shoppers, I think it's worth spending on anything that goes between you and the ground, e.g. tires, shoes, bikes, etc.

Though I'm sure that adage has also been incorporated into modern pricing models and every damn thing is a fucking scam to manipulate you into thinking you've made a shrewd and balanced decision when you spend just a weeee bit more.

I despise every company with a fiery passion.

Expensive doesn't mean the shoes are good, but cheap does mean they are shit. Of course you also get different types of shoe that may not directly compare with others.

Then you also get different shops selling the same product at different prices.

I selected my toaster by visiting a store and physically fiddling with the levers. From 20€ onwards, the feeling got noticeably better until 120€ price point after which it got worse. The range ended at 300€ SMEG(ma) toaster that felt like what it sounds like. I’m happy with my 120€ toaster.

What store are you shopping at that has €300 toasters??? How could anyone ever get that much value from a toaster???

It’s crazy I know. They were bad quality.

You spent 120€ to toast bread! I don't think you get it...

It's the best toaster apparently. Tbh I don't know why I would care about the feeling of the lever but at least they have the best toaster lever money can buy.

For that kind of money I would expect it to make, cut and toast the bread for me.

Idk some people use their toasters multiple times a day, and at that point it can make sense to spend more on a better toaster

I toast a lot of bread and wanted a good toaster that will last a long time. I’m expecting to get minimum of 25 years of daily toasting out of it.

We are drowning in Temu trash. Maybe we should start to look at things from other than monetary perspective. I selected a good toaster and looked at the price tag afterwards. Apparently you can get shitty toasters for 20€ and 300€ but a good one costs exactly 120€

My rule of thumb is the second-cheapest popular option.

That’s true but the other direction is generally true. Not always, but often high quality does come at a cost.

That's a great one

Broke: You get what you pay for.

Woke: You don’t get what you don’t pay for.

With automobiles, there is an anti-correlation.

that is true, or just slapping a label like supreme, or tesla on thier products and people thinks its high quality. or with ELECTRIC toothbruses, 100-200 seems to be more likely to be defective than cheaper lines of the same company. Always seek out reviews and peoples experience on specific products. same goes with healthcare/insurance, paying more doesnt mean you will get better quality(it actually incentivized that customers dont seek out care due to potential costs), likewise if you get too cheap of insurance you will get cheap results, not decent and not so-so.

Fuck me that is a lot, think my electric toothbrush was like £20-30

the higher price one are the "smart toothbruses" its not worth it anyways. either go off-brand or buy the 1000-1500 oral braun series.

Mine was oral-b but didn't cost much. Their pricing seems to be very high base price but often heavily discounted so it would be silly to buy at full price. Was one of their cheaper ones but it seems fine and better than my old one which was also oral-b, largely went for it as the toothbrush heads I have would still be compatible. The old one was wearing through the plastic but it was over 5 years old by that point, battery isn't great either.

Replaceable batteries would be kinda nice to have as a feature but if other parts are wearing away by that point too it probably isn't too bad.

Tax Brackets. "I got a pay raise and will now be taxed more and make less money than before the raise"

If <=30k was taxed at 25% and 30+k taxed at 30% and you go from 30k to 31k a year, only the 1k is taxed at the higher rate.

Benefit cliffs do exist however.

I get that this might not be super intuitive. but how can one not notice that this is untrue? don't people check their accounts and see that there is still more coming in and not less? just not as much as one might want, but still.

You assume people look at their accounts and do some form of account keeping?

Actually, yeah. I just cannot fathom how one could not at least check what goes in and what comes out. Nowadays you get push notifications for everything anyways, so I just do not get it.

This depends on the country

Is this really a common misconception?

Yes, unfortunately.

Very very common in Australia.

That their neurodiversity absolves them of any responsibility and the rest of the world should cater to it.

This is true, but at the same time it does not mean that people shouldn’t be given reasonable accommodation for their particular needs.

Many people struggle to grasp that these two ideas can coexist.

Embarrassingly, I think I'm someone who struggles with both ideas. How many meltdowns am I expected to accommodate before someone is not invited back to a social event? A work event? Because if a neurotypical yelled obscenities at me, it would be one and done, but I'm expected to forgive and forget when the person is autistic. How many times do you accommodate someone's tardiness? I have ADHD, and I work really hard to be on time, but I'm late plenty. Sometimes for work. Often for social events. It's not because i don't care about other people's time. I try really hard, I just fail a lot. Like who decides what's reasonable?

Perhaps the question you should be asking is why are the meltdowns happening in the first place?

Accommodations aren’t about tolerating bad behaviour. They’re about changing the environment to be more friendly, and putting systems in place to help people manage things better.

Ooh that's a good point! I hadn't looked at it like that!

Of course the meltdown I'm thinking of is that his own toddler was trying to eat old food off the floor and I was preventing that and offering fresh food while babysitting for free for him.

He doesn't have meltdowns so often now, but the only thing that changed is that he feels safe and comfortable around us. Ironically, his bad behavior is what made us uncomfortable around him which is what made him feel unsafe. So as it got better, it just got better and better.

Unfortunately for him, he was raised in an emotionally abusive home, so his regular bad behavior was learned and then when we reacted poorly to that it would lead to an actual meltdown. Consistent kind behavior and firm boundaries is what eventually led to a two way street respectful situation. A meltdown now would be much more accepted and understood but we had to go to group therapy to get here.

Oh god yes. Good friend of mine was dating someone with autism, and he was constantly asking me, "is neurodivergence just an excuse to be a dick to people?" Yeah sometimes it sure is, just a helpless excuse to act out your baser, ruder instincts. If you're neurodivergent and not in therapy, you should be asking yourself regularly, would others around me benefit from my being in therapy? Because the answer is almost certainly yes.

Absolutely fair, good answer!

That understanding someone or something means agreeing with them.

Or that refusing to understand is a valid counterargument.

But no one explicitly refuses to understand. Usually it's person A doesn't agree with person B, and person B thinks person A refuses to understand, while in reality person A understands perfectly but disagrees

Way too many people think that if you explain something, you're endorsing it--even when you explicitly say that you do not endorse it. So frustrating, and it's a huge problem here on the fediverse.

Exactly. Like, how do you expect to beat an opponent if your refuse to understand why they do what they do?

Or that not vocally disagreeing is agreement.

On a related note, this is one of my favorite quotes: "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -Aristotle

Folks, you can understand why someone decided to kill themselves: e.g. a tragic life, and from their perspective, there's no one to support them, no one to love them, no one for them to love.

But it doesn't mean you agree with their decision to kill themselves.

If understanding = agreeing, a lot more people would be committing suicide while trying to understand why such a person would kill themselves. It makes no logical sense. Or it means that those alive is either of these: they either don't understand it out of naivety, or choose to not understand it to not kill themselves. Assuming it's an adult with their full faculty, who witnessed such a tragedy, that's just... such a sad world.

I'm not sure if its get what you mean.

For example, I can put in the effort to try and understand why a triple Trumper MAGA Republican did what they did without agreeing with the actions they took.

Oh jesus I'm a moron lmao. I misread what you said given the context of my post.

So many things when it comes to police stops. There is absolutely a problem with policing in America but there is a list of things you ARE required to do when stopped by the police, whether you agree with them or not, and refusing doesn't help you and only helps them. Yes you are required to have your license on you when driving, and yes you must display and/or hand it over to police when asked. Yes they can ask you to step out of the car. Yes they can search your car if they tow it. Hell watch a few videos on YouTube of traffic stops and you'll quickly figure out what you do and do not have to comply with. And you will never, ever win an argument with the police on the side of the road, save it for court.

One thing to note is that they are allowed to lie to you, so like you said, important to know your rights, but mostly they can find probable cause to do whatever.

Best advice I ever heard.

Always treat cops as if they just came from dealing with something really awful.

They might have just seen a child abuse case, or a really bad accident, of a fire.

Assert your rights in the court, not in the street.

POLITELY assert your rights on the streets. If an officer asks if they can search your trunk, tell them that you would rather they didn't.

"Do I have to" and it's variants are deferential without necessarily ceding your rights in a way that "oh, sure" does. They don't need any cause at all if you give permission, and if you give permission it's going to be hard or impossible to argue later that it was an unreasonable search.

The sad truth is that you need to assume that you're on camera whenever you interact with a police officer, act as if whatever you say will be either edited and shown to the jury or described to them out of context to justify whatever bad actions the officer takes.

100% be polite and even friendly, but 0% on "just let the officer do whatever and think you can fight it in court later."

Very simple, “I do not consent to any search,” but do not interfere with armed people. Once you have asserted your right, you should not try to impede them violating them. Too risky. Let the courts protect you. Or hope that they do, at least.

Fantastic response

Math is memorizing and performing algorithms. So many adults looked at the common core math curriculum and said teachers aren't teaching math anymore because they didn't see their favorite long division algorithm taught, but memorizing and performing any particular algorithm is not what is important about learning math. Math is about taking axioms and seeing what you can build with them.

The word you're missing is "arithmetic". For most people "math(s)" and "arithmetic" are the same thing, when the latter is only the commonly encountered part of the former.

And for many of those people, algorithms are the only way they can use arithmetic to reach a goal because the intuition isn't there otherwise.

I say this in full knowledge that even though I'm pretty good at arithmetic, much of the intuition I have now took me years after leaving school, and sometimes for more advanced things it's still not there.

For example, on a good day I can complete the square, and I understand the geometric intuition, but most of the time I'm just going to plug and chug with the quadratic formula.

Common core got a really bad rap because of the poor implementations by companies like Pearson. But the actual curricula are very good.

Pure maths that was taught over 5 years in the 18th century in university is now taught in 3 years in high school with several other subjects.

So material is stripped down into small pieces and learnt by heart completely out of context- it is basically just learning algorithms.

For me it was estimation that unlocked the magic of mathematics. What's the fastest way you can get close enough to the correct answer that the innaccuracy doesn't matter?

For example, in salary negotions if you need to convert between hourly and annual salary take the annual value, drop 3 zeros and divide in two and you have the hourly. Or in reverse, take the hourly, multiply by 2 and add 3 zeros for the annual. It gets you close enough that you can know you're talking about for salary negotiations, budgeting, etc. and you can let the computer calculate out the exact conversion for payroll and tax withholding purposes

Photography is so much more than pointing a camera and pushing the button, even though cell phones have reduced it to that for a lot of people.

Good photography requires intention, planning, luck, skill in knowing how to compose a scene, knowledge of light and color temperature, sensor exposure, how to direct people about if people are involved, and then, in editing in post-production, skillful edits, adjusting tone, doing masking, color grading and calibration, and any other steps to perfect an image.

For me to produce one work here on this site, it can take me two or three hours, not including travel time!

Great answer!

And also worth mentioning that 1 great photo comes after 50 or so not-so-good ones. A lot comes down to luck, especially with more dynamic shots. Take a shit ton of photos and a few of them are bound to turn out nice.

I learnt the team "Point and shoot engineer" to refer to modern cinematographers/ photographers.

This took me a lot of work but I’m glad I made it.

They looks great!

That because a problem is real, any proposed solution to it is a good idea, and anyone arguing against a proposed solution doesn't want to solve the problem.

Yes, grease fires are bad. No, you should not use water to put it out. No, that does not mean I am pro-grease-fire??

People think successful software is usually made by huge teams.

In actuality, most open source is just one or a couple of people building something they found useful and releasing it. Even corporate software is usually a small team. Sure some software has huge numbers of people working on it (google for example) but its not the norm. Your bank app, this site here, all very small teams.

I remember when bitcoin first started and I got into the idea of sending $$ with it. First couple of years had less than 100 people in total touch it. And 90% of it was a couple of people at most.

A bit of a tangent, but most software has NO plan if that person or people walk away from the project. Or just straight up die. We live in a somewhat golden era when software has only just started outliving its builders. But watch the next 20-40 years. It will be interesting times.

I was surprised when I learned that. Same with the idea that adding more people to a software project doesn't make it go faster. To be clear, I am very ignorant on software stuff in general.

But surely if we add another eight women to the team they can deliver the baby in one month...

Yeah I'm sure that's an appropriate analogy.

Even open source projects with lots of contributors, most work is only done by a fairly small number generally. Have seen delegation before though, like "would be cool if you all make PRs for this" where it's a time consuming but essentially low programming high creative skill task.

Sure some software has huge numbers of people working on it

But this makes usually a overengineered and buggy bloat for the task at hand. Just like Google.

That science is rational and objective.

In reality, the way that science works is much muddier than most realise. It's full of subjectivity, and this isn't a bug, but a feature. Intuition and tacit knowledge play a big role in basically any research (and this is why I am confident that AI can't replace scientists). Politics are also present at every stage of the process. Science is at its least objective when scientists convince themselves that they're being objective. We can't escape our biases, so we need to actively acknowledge them and embrace the subjectivity of our situated perspectives.

The problem is that talking about this is a great way to piss off other scientists. I've been accused before of "betraying the side", by a scientist who was aware that science has a disproportionately large epistemic platform (epistemic means pertaining to knowledge — basically just that as a result of the huge benefits of scientific advancements in the last century or so, science has been on a bit of a pedestal in terms of trusted expert knowledge in society. Criticising this is seen by a betrayal by some because of the concerning rise in psuedoscience and anti-scientific rhetoric.

However, I'm of the belief that some of what has driven the rise of psuedoscience is that the average person doesn't like to be told "shut up and do what the smart people say". They feel a lot of mistrust towards society (which, in many cases, is entirely reasonable, especially in the case of marginalised groups who have been heavily exploited by science and scientists),

The problem goes far beyond just science, but I think this is certainly an aspect of it. I sympathise with scientists who want to continue to have the privileged position they hold, but I don't think that's helpful in the long term.

Yeah, I wholeheartedly encourage constructive debate and skepticism. However, it doesn't excuse repeating shitty arguments without doing anything thinking or research just because it makes you feel less bad and lets you not do anything.

One example that particularly bothers me was "humans affect on the climate is less than a single volcanic eruption". There are a lot of things you could not trust about scientific reporting, but the base premise of 8 billion people flying around the world using decomposed dinosaur mass is at least an order-of magnitude larger in scale compared to a single volcanic eruption. At that point, you'd have to believe that there isn't really 8 billion people or that oil is actually from somewhere else.

In summary I agree, I just want to add nuance that this doesn't excuse people acting in bad faith. It's important that everyone, not just scientists, recognize their emotions and bias and challenge their own arguments against these (I.e. am I just making this argument because I feel defensive?)

volcanic eruptions can be pretty big btw

this one here caused a famine as a side effect for example

I'm aware. Do you have something more to say?

just saying, "humans cause less effect than a big volcano eruption" isn't the gotcha that people seem to think

Ok, so what I'm hearing is that you're agreeing with me that it's a silly argument, but for a different reason - that volcano's are devastating and we shouldn't settle for just "less than devastating". Is that right?

It initially seemed like you were arguing that volcanoes are bigger that I was aware of, and therefore might be more impactful than humans on the environment. But that's probably because people always argue online 😅

The phrase I've heard is "epistemically privileged." And deservedly because from a standpoint of pure ethics, "science" has done way more good than damage than competing ways of looking at the world.

But let's say someone asks you how a car works. You go into a bit about the internal combustion engine. You explain how little explosions make pistons go. They ask you about these explosions, so you have to take them to a chemist to explain. Then they ask the chemist why does this reaction happen, and the chemist sends them to the physicist. You go through the Newtonian bit, which seems intuitive enough, but when you ask about atoms, you have to go into subatomic physics. Which is something you cannot experience without special equipment that you trust the physicist is telling the truth about.

So, yeah, while the empirical method is fantastic and the best model we have, in the end it relies on faith as much as any religion.

You had me up until,

So, yeah, while the empirical method is fantastic and the best model we have, in the end it relies on faith as much as any religion

I feel like faith is the wrong word because the works that science hath wrought upon our world are due in part to its repeatability. When you follow the steps to build an engine and refine fuel for it, that engine will always run, and if it doesn't, it's due to a parts issue or a fuel issue that can be remediated. It always works because the laws of physics always apply (local variables notwithstanding).

I don't have faith that my engine will start; I have absolute confidence based on my limited understanding aligned with repeated observations. I have evidence; where faith is often analogous to belief without or in spite of the evidence. Not that you may use that definition of faith, necessarily, and that's fine; but that's the definition I'm accustomed to thanks to being raised in a Protestant cult bubble.

in pseudoscience, person will seek answers they want to hear, and not ones that will contradict them at all. an example, chronic lyme which is a pseudoscience, is a belief that Lyme is a 'permanent infectious disease', and you can get it numerous ways other than the known vector, a deer tick(it is the actual way to get lyme) theres a whole industry built over this surprisingly, and hazardous because MDs have jumped into the scams too, and its primarly amongst MIDWESTERN white woman/men, how this scam works is the "patient" will go seeking online forums, sources and eventually end in the office of LLMD("lyme doctors" which are actual doctors peddling the fake disease) which often charges alot of money per visit, usually several hundred and they dont take insurance(red flag) or the insurance rejects the DOCTOR and they give all thESE BS excuses why you have this symptoms and then prescribe you a blood test for lyme(another red flag), and then have you multi-month ANTIBIOTIC regiments, which can be hazardous because of the side effects. i happened to find these forums along time ago. most of these people have underlying mental issues, or a psychosomatic illness.

Long Covid was also a goldmine for the medical quackery institutions.

Great answer.

I still haven't read it myself but you might be interested in the book "The Structure of Scientific Revolutions" by Thomas S. Kuhn

Looking up scientific papers of any kind will immediately blow up the notion that science is rational and objective lol

well i've made good experiences with the papers of NTRS (nasa technical report server) especially with regards to water on mars. some are very well written. but yeah, in general, there's a lot of papers that suck, especially in psychological medicine and sociology field.

Decimation means "lose 10%", not "lose all BUT 10℅"

If two people suddenly quit your twenty-man team you've been decimated. If eight or eighteen people quit you've been devastated.

(Plus a bunch of "politics" and civil rights things.)

Linguistics just doesn’t deal with definitions like that. It does mean that, and certainly even connotatively historically. Today, in modern parlance, it definitely means “to kill a large portion of” something, and is almost never used as a 10% reference. So your team could be correctly described as “decimated” in both scenarios.

Dictionaries are free to note whatever definition they want, but so is everyone else

Language - wait for it - evolves.

I've always just interpreted the deca latin base as meaning exponential.

Linguistics are descriptive, not prescriptive. There can be no "common misconception" in language, because the moment a misconception is common enough, it becomes true

Linguistic drift requires a considerable majority understanding, not just a large minority

By way of example, no matter how many men think "chartreuse" is a vaguely pink color or that "trans-man" includes Caitlyn Jenner, it'll still be lime-green and Eliot Page.

Great answer

Worked in a company that decimated their workforce with redundancies. I word it correctly and other people wrongly assume it means something else.

That people are either purely evil or purely good. I once argued with a homophobe who wanted to protect her children from seeing lesbians on tv. She said she had to protect her kids because they came to her from turbulent backgrounds. So she adopted kids in need, that makes her a good person. Still, she was a bigot and teaching her kids to be bigots and that is a problem. Homophobia is bad and harmful but not all homophobes are automatically completely horrible people.

As an add-on to this, people having the thought pattern of:

They're saying that my friend said something racist -> Therefore they're saying my friend is a racist (TM) -> However, my friend is a good person -> Therefore they're not a racist -> Therefore what my friend said wasn't racist -> Therefore the people calling my friend out are the bad guys

You can substitute in words like homophobic, transphobic, ableist, classist etc. for racist — the flow goes the same. An excellent book that helped me to understand this was "racism without racists". Reading that as a teenager helped me to more constructively respond when I have been called out for prejudiced attitudes, such as racism.

It makes me feel deeply uncomfortable to think of myself as a racist — and so I don't. However, unlike people who default to this thought pattern that turns cognitive dissonance into indignant resistance to change, I work to accept the fact that I am absolutely capable of doing, saying or thinking racist shit — it'd be hard not to, when I've grown up in a systemically racist culture. But I can acknowledge that without blaming myself for it, which allows me to avoid the discomfort of considering myself a racist whilst maintaining my moral fortitude.

A phrase that's helped me a lot is "you're not responsible for your first thought; you are responsible for your second". That helps me to actually interrogate where something is coming from if I catch myself having a reflexive thought that shocks or disgusts me. Unfortunately, this habit isn't one that many people have.

Thinking about things in terms of innate essences people have (even if they're less binary than good Vs evil) is harmful even when we're just looking at harms to ourselves. For instance, I was a super bright kid, and "the smart one" was a core pillar of my identity. However, as I entered my teens, I was so scared of losing this that I became more concerned with appearing smart than actually being smart. It felt like something I didn't have control over, which was terrifying. But I often say that I got a hell of a lot smarter when I let myself be dumb. That's because when I think about what a smart person actually does that makes them smart, it's stuff like being curious about the world, self reflecting on one's beliefs and knowledge and being open to being corrected etc.. It was a lot less pressure once I stopped thinking about things in terms of immutable, innate essences

I find myself with "racist" emotions often. After 9/11 we had months of terrifying imagery, the concept that nobody is safe, and the images of a turban-beard-combo alongside it.

Not being from a very multicultural area, when I see that classic look I dont think "guy going to work" I think "maybe got a bomb?". I actively work against it and ignore it, but it was deliberately and forcefully brainwashed into us.

Im so cheered up to see you saying "youre not responsible for your first thought, but you are for your second thought".

Conservatism.

Just...all of it lol.

Being hesitant to change and wanting to temper out things and make sure things are implemented effectively is one thing. And ensuring we respect tradition and culture is another (though progressives are more in line with that lol.)

Today's conservatism is just hate and bigotry. And they don't even recognize it as such.

Yeah this drives me crazy. I grew up where the old white men loved boating and fishing in the rivers, bringing the family out to enjoy nature. Now that it's all getting contaminated and turning gross, even the dumbest person who actually valued 'conserving' would realise we actually have to do something.

Instead, we've got billboards up and down the country trashing the Paris agreement and the old white men are only interested in attacking the other tribe. Not a hint of concern for the environment. They're not interested in conserving anything other than their social status and corresponding power.

When you grow old, life will be as easy as when you are young.

No, it will be much harder. And in the end, it will be so hard that you can't do it anymore.

For me this has been a curve not a slope. Hard childhood, getting better in later middle age, expect a harder time later but so far things have been easier.

So I think "it gets better" is a reasonable thing to say to kids having a hard time. It can get better.

Old old? Yes I agree. Even healthy old people, your friends are dying around you, it hurts.

That if something is marketed with health-based language or claims, it must be true. (or that things that are healthy offset other unhealthy activities/behaviors/consumption, i.e. "I might have eaten a ton of ice cream today, but I had a lot of protein so that'll make up for it")

Way too many people buy into "healthy" products, especially the very expensive ones, without doing so much as a single search regarding if it's even necessary for them, or if that particular product is even healthy in the way it appears.

People think anything with protein is inherently healthy, and the more the better, even if their body can't use all the protein they consume, so they'll eat multiple protein bars, have meat with every meal, and drink a protein shake every day.

Someone on social media says eating all raw meat and drinking raw milk is healthy, and they don't even look up how much more likely you are to get a disease from consuming them. (not to mention the impact on their wallet)

A drink will be advertised as a "wellness shot" and is just some fruit juice with ginger, but people will pay 8 bucks for it every day assuming it'll revolutionize their health, then drink a bunch of beer later that night and wonder why they feel awful later.

Hell, people will even take multivitamins or supplement powders that have 100's of %'s of their recommended daily intake, and just assume that if they get 500% of their recommended vitamin B, they'll magically become "healthy" by doing so, instead of "only" getting 100%.

'Made with real fruit' is a perfect example...they almost never say how much

Our blueberry muffins are made with real fruit!

Yep, bits of grape skins to simulate blueberry skins + blue dye and just enough blueberry juice to keep regulators happy.

and tbh straight fruit isn't always good for you, especially not when they're taking out the pulp / fiber.

They have to say the proportion in the ingredients.

In the US the ingredients are listed in order but not with the actual quantity. So if they're listed as like "water, sugar, strawberry, ..." then you know there's more sugar than strawberry but not by how much. The nutrition label gives proportions of macro and micro nutrients, though.

Only kinda in the US. The ingredients must be listed in order of prevalence. They absolutely aren't required to tell you how much of which ingredient, because of "trade secrecy" laws so that you aren't able to recreate a "Big Mac,' for instance, despite the fact that you can totally find all that info in public domain, should you look.

"I might have eaten a ton of ice cream today, but I had a lot of protein so that'll make up for it")

There is another one. In the end, you can see proteins as just another form of calories; if you don't exercise them off, a overabundance of them becomes fat. Proteins are not generally healthy or make muscles just like that.
And btw, eggs are the best protein source. While of oats it's still around 10% accessible.

People think anything with protein is inherently healthy, and the more the better, even if their body can’t use all the protein they consume, so they’ll eat multiple protein bars, have meat with every meal, and drink a protein shake every day.

oh i wish that all the protein shakes contained at least a little bit of fat. for some reason, people unreasonably believe that all fat is bad. idk people think that "fat makes you fat" or sth which is very much not true

fat does not make you fat. carbs make you fat, because they give you energy faster than the body can use it. fat, on the other hand, does not provide energy so quickly. so it does not make you fat.

food, especially the "protein shakes" and such, should contain more fat, and less sugar. especially less sugar.

I think some offsets are valid. For example exercise for ice cream. Especially if you do it while the sugars from the ice cream is still in your blood

Ehhh depends on the exercise and your goals. If you biked 5 miles to get the ice cream and now are biking 5 miles home you definitely have enough calorie deficit for the day that the ice cream is inconsequential. But if your goal is to lose weight, filling your calorie deficits from excercise with treats isn't very productive at all

The fact there's a fairly large amount of people eating raw meat and milk and there isn't widespread illnesses in those communities is an endorsement of how safe our food industry is.

People who disagree with you are not necessarily evil, stupid or uninformed.

False

I'd agree with you, but then we'd both be wrong.

Oh you evil, stupid, uninformed.....!!!!!!

True

many people still ignore, or dont believe white privilege is still pervasive in western countries. aside from the racists, some people of those groups do not want to discuss it ever because they still benefited fom all that abuse, strip mining of resources centuries ago.

White people often forget (or don't realize in the first place) that, if you're a black person in USA, the police is actively looking for an excuse to put you in jail so they can make you do slave labor

The whole notion that a living is something that needs to be earned.

Depends where you live. But overall survival requires effort, whether that’s hunting/gathering or office work.

many people say farmers create the food, but actually, the plants do most of the work, they're out there in the field every day, growing. while the farmers only visits twice a year: to sow and to harvest

That they need to buy cases and cases of water in plastic bottles which they throw in the landfill instead of just drinking their perfectly good tap water.

Depending on your municipality, sure.

Don't know why you got downvoted. I drank tap water in India and threw up 3 times before leaving the office. I've seen the data center water and it looked worse.

Ummm, my tap water isn't "perfectly good."

Ummm, my comment was addressing the millions of people whose water IS perfectly good but they buy bottled water anyway.

Well mine is actually perfectly good safety-wise, but it tastes like shit. I eventually got a reverse osmosis system so I don't waste any bottles anymore. Instead I waste water. BUT... But, when I'm at other people's houses, if the water tastes fine, I drink that and refuse bottles. This is the best I can do.

In most of Europe, it is.

Plenty of people saying their tap water is not good. Just buy/install an RO for your tap ya dummy. They aren't that expensive or difficult to install. Or some kind of brita-type filter. I'm lucky enough to have an in-fridge filter. Cold, clean water on tap. It's the best.

Bottled water companies don't produce water. They produce plastic bottles.

They probably don't even produce the bottles. They probably just put the water in the bottles.

Good point. And it's often just municipal water too. So uh... Tap water.

I live in the US, I’m not drinking the tap water lol. That being said you don’t have to buy cases of individual plastic water bottles either.

And yet millions do. Maybe there's something actually wrong with your water, but the vast majority of municipal water in the US is perfectly fine.

If the tap is chemically fine, but still tastes awful, I get buying bottled water instead

Why would you buy bottled water? Buy a filter

Basically, anything around exercise. You can get strong as hell while rarely ever being sore. Your body requires rest in order to build up muscle and deload weeks can actually improve gains. However, most people don’t need as much rest as they think they do after injuries. Possibly the amount of rest that people try to get after injuries may prolong the injury.

Diet and exercise are such big controversial things.

my guess is that's because people's bodies are very different actually when it comes to the optimal diet and exercise routine

de

Here, you dropped this

Whoops, thanks

A lot of people have never (knowingly) met a trans person and it shows. The moment someone uses the phrase "man in a dress" unironically, they demonstrate that they are not someone worth talking to.

I disagree. Why can't a man wear a dress? If they identify as a man but want to wear a sundress on a warm summer day, that's fine. Bro you're rocking that dress should be normalized .

Oh that usage is totally fine, I'm specifically referring to the "trans women are men in dresses" crowd

By all means, rock that sundress

While that's reasonable, there are genuinely people out there who do not know.

My ex hit me with that exact phrase, and once I'd explained what trans people really are she changed tack straight away. Trans people do not have a legal status here, and she's now quite determined to be a good ally.

That's a reasonable statement.

More people have attachment issues than they realize, some estimates put it at 50% of people are insecurely attached. This causes a lot of the issues both in world politics, and your personal lives

Interesting answer, thanks!

not all "sugar free" subsitute sweetner is sugar free. if you look at ingredients, maltodetrexin, dextrose or equivalent is just sugar in another form. these companies word it in a way to obfuscate that they use actual sugar to sell sweetener as"sugar free". misconceptions about gluten free products, unless you re actually have CELIACs, gluten products wont have noticible effects on you. leaky gut or whater gluten is asscotiate with in healthy people is just marketing and pseudoscience.

Recipes are even worse. "Low sugar" recipe, it uses a shitload of honey or maple syrup instead.

its marketing and obfuscation of the ingredients. if you look at the nutritional facts, you can tell its not the case, anything honey/fruity next to this product like bread or yogurt, you can guaranteed is sugar, although not added sugar.

It is really incredible how once you start reducing your sugar intake so much of the super-sugary overly-sweet everything everywhere just stops mattering because you just can't stand to eat more than a bite or two of it

I used to like pickled beetroot but now what they have in shops is far too sweet. Normally find pouring the liquid out and replacing it with vinegar makes them taste like they should.

Hopefully growing my own to try pickling, time will tell how well they grow. Already pickled quite a few radishes. Not sure if I will keep growing them though, moving to more perennial crops and tubers/bulbs.

Or that sugar substitutes don't cause diabetes. Diabetes rates took off after diet sodas went mainstream.

It's amazing how much good just going "if it looks/tastes like it's mostly sugar and unidentifiable calories it almost definitely is very unhealthy for you" is. My wife's a big soda drinker and my kids are starting to hit the age where many people pick up soda addictions. I push hard for them to mostly drink water and make sure to tell them how bad soft drinks are, and when they get upset about seeing the difference between what I say and what my wife does I tell them "you can make that decision for yourself when you're a grown-up"

One of the big ones: motivation.

Most people when talking/thinking about "motivation" are referring to extrinsic motivation.

Even if they make a distinction between intrinsic and extrinsic, they basically assume these add together to create "more" motivation.

However, they don't sum together. One crowds out the other, like in a neverending battle.

i've always thought that it's really simple. there's extrinsic motivation and intrinsic motivation

extrinsic motivation is when somebody stands next to you and beats you with a stick when you do something that they don't like. the result is i will do the minimum slop required to fit their criteria, like when i'm asked to do the dishes, i'll just make them look clean without actually scrubbing them.

intrinsic motivation is when i see the meaningfulness of an action, at which point my body starts acting towards that goal automatically.

You can win in a game of chance.

But you win sometimes!?!? /S haha. Agreed.

Of course you win!
It's like feeding the fish before fishing. :D

Awww, came here with my political soap box :(

Thanks for reading

People who put their toast butter side down are idiots, that much we can all agree on.

Yes, but if you eat it buttered side down you'll taste the butter better.

Your tastebuds are on the top of your tongue

So turn your bread

upside down

Used to be a jingle for a brand of margarine in Australia.

I’ve been eating toast wrong.

Our sun's proper name in English is not Sol. It's just the Sun. It's referred to as Sol in various scifi franchises and some Romance languages which is where the misconception comes from, but in English it's just "the Sun."

Yeah, well, me and Sol are bros, so imma keep calling him by the cool nickname he got when he was travelling through Spain

Better Call Sol.

Isn't sol latin?

It is, and it's Spanish as well.

I think part of it just comes from the practice of naming other star systems after the star they orbit. E.g. the Epsilon Eridani system orbits Epsilon Eridani. Our own star system is generically called the "Solar System," so sci-fi likes to formalize into the Sol System.

Money is real.

Either a strong religious belief or the belief that success is the result of hard work.

Irs impossible to build beautiful citys like they used to. It is still possible and cheaper even

Climat ≠ Weather

Artificial leather is better than natural leather for the enviorment (its not. Atleast where i am from you are not allowed to rais cattle just for leather production. And i rather would use all parts of a slaughtered animal that had to die, than poluting nature with chemicals)

I think animal welfare is the bigger factor for most people avoiding leather, and while artificial leather is just plastic and certainly not great environmentally, traditional leather production is also very very much polluting nature with chemicals (Chromium tanning etc. ) plus it still supports the whole factory farming system which is terrible in its own right. I'm hoping fungus based leather or some lab grown variant will bring a real alternative someday.

Natural leather is durable and lasting and where its used can be repaired, unlike artificial leather.

If a cow has to be killed due to people wanting its meat, why waste its hide instead of using it? The poluter here is the meat industry. Not leather production. To turn hide into leather one can use chemicals yes, but natural tanning is still used widely.

In a perfect world lether can also come from animals that have died of natural causes.

Plastic leather also wears out so quickly. Real leather is much stronger and easier to repair/restore.

As the person highlighted (and you have expanded on), there are a lot of ethical and sustainability problems with the leather industry as it is, but I think it'd be far better to improve the problems with natural leather than to expect much from the plastic leather

You've got to keep in mind that everyone doesn't feel the same. I personally feel gross having anything to do with leather because I can't shake the feeling it's a corpse's skin. It would be the same to me if it was a dead human's skin.

I'm not asking for understanding on how I feel, but more just understanding that maybe natural leather is the best option for most people right now in terms of environmental impact - but it's important we develop other solutions too and try to make them more environmentally over time, because not everyone is the same.

They make vege leather nowadays, I think. Never got my hands on anything made of it because it was so expensive, though.

Assumed Intelligence is not smart and does not have any understanding of the concepts of true or false.

Most people here have been using AI in some form for their entire lives without knowing it. It just did its job quietly with nobody noticing. Then venture capital (or just capitalism itself) ruined everything and broke the contract: publicly acquired data must be given back to the public for free.

I could pontificate at length about the terminology and how it has gotten fucked. The blending of the terms itself is part of what makes it difficult to have a reasonable and nuanced discussion.

Let's take a moment to separate out AI from machine learning from deep learning from LLMs.

AI is fucking old. It used to mean "any algorithms that create intelligent behavior". Not a particularly useful definition these days, but it used to mean things like pathfinding and searching.

Machine learning is a more useful phrase: a set of algorithms to solve problem where we don't know "how", but we have examples of inputs and outputs. For example, I don't know how I would define cute, but if someone showed me a bunch of photos I could probably say which ones were cute, not cute, and unsure.

Deep learning is a subset of machine learning that uses a specific set of algorithms: neutral networks.

LLMs are a subset of deep learning that use "transformers". Which is a specific architecture that does a lot of things quite well, like determine how proteins fold, how drugs interact, how words interact in a sentence, etc.

If you've used Google Maps at any point since it was created, you've used classical AI.

If you've used email, you've used machine learning.

If you've used a photos app that lets you search for similar pictures of people, you've used machine learning.

If you've had more than one prescription filled in the past five years, your pharmacist has used AI (even if they don't know it) to check potential drug interactions.

Don't get me wrong, I fucking hate that the field I spent my whole life researching has been coopted into a way to siphon money from people into the coffers of the richest fucking parasites, but when people say "fuck AI" they have either lost the nuance or never had it. Everyone that hears the message experiences on the surface and it does them a disservice.

When the luddites broke the textile looms, did they hate the machines or did they hate the loss of their livelihoods?

When the early industialists broke into factories and smashed their equipment, did they hate the machines or did they hate the captains of industry that forced them to work inhumane hours in terrible conditions?

When people say "fuck AI" do they hate the math that, until this point, has led to a better world for us all, or do they hate the system that has enshittified it into one of pure exploitation?

This whole mess feels like a distraction to me. Tech should be a social good. It should be helping people. Not to say it's without problems, but now when we say "fuck AI" it leads us to pushing back against technology itself rather than the system that's using it to hurt people.

I like my professor's view in AI from over a decade ago. AI is the term non commercially viable research. Once something becomes viable it gets rebranded, like automatic text recognition, computer vision, machine learning, llms. It worked great until generative AI was good enough to impress average people, then it became a great way to attract venture capital. It's still not quite viable so the rule holds, but we are in a very messy and public era where several products are likely to emerge and separate from the AI title.

That "intelligent" and "smart" mean the same thing.

Knowledge is knowing tomato is a fruit.

Wisdom is knowing to not put it in a fruit salad.

Tomatoes are both a fruit (botanically) and a vegetable (culinarily). "Vegetable" doesn't have a botanical definition, so the old aphorism about tomatoes "not being a vegetable" is trying to conflate terms from two different domains and hoping you don't notice.

And a large number of "fruits" aren't even a fruit. We're kinda bad at naming things sometimes

A large number of culinary fruits aren't even botanical fruits, yes. Most of them are botanical berries (and some things that aren't botanical berries are still culinary berries). Conflating the two linguistic domains causes lots of problems!

Well, more than 50% of people tend to think they are average. So illusions of mediocrity?

More than 50% of people can be average, depends on the distribution.

Yes, but I'm more coming from the humorous aspect than the mathematical

97% of people are average (3 standard deviations), so they are not deluded. Its actually higher than that as the intellectually impaired don't live very long.

What other people really think of them.

It's like that joke on The Simpsons.

Fat Tony thinks of himself as a legitimate businessman with 75 arrests and only three convictions, while Ned Flanders thinks he'll burn in Hell if he doesn't pay his taxes by January 3.

You never know just how you look through other people's eyes.

Some will die in hot pursuit in fiery auto crashes. Some will die in hot pursuit while sifting through my ashes.

How so?

"USA is a democracy". It is a country where corruption is legal Lobby groups and election donations are de-facto corruption.

US is a senate cosplaying as a democracy

Everyone thinks they're a good driver whereas most of us aren't. If everyone was a good driver there would be no need for all these safety measures built into cars.

Even the best drivers in the world fuck up sometimes, so even if everyone was good they should still exist.

For some things, i agree (ABS, TCS, etc), but i don't think it would be the same for everything.

I'm pretty sure staying in the left lane on the interstate for 57 miles is best practice.

well, i know that i'm not a good driver, that's why i don't drive!

One of the biggest misconceptions is that internet discussion is political action.

11/10 answer

Pandas reproduce just fine in nature. The myth of them being bad at fucking and making babies was a myth started from before we understood zoochosis. No animal wants to have babies in a prison, it’s not just pandas.

Many people think that anything they do really matters.

Then again, other people think that nothing they do really matters.

That humans aren't born selfish. They are. If you aren't selfish, you don't cry when you are hungry and you don't get enough to eat. People learn that not being selfish can be valuable as they grow.

Idk if I'd say a baby crying because it's hungry is a display of selfishness. It's the only way they can communicate, and they aren't able to help themselves. I will say however that I don't think selfishness is inherently a bad thing and many people if not everyone does display some form of it.

How about religion? Is that an option?

That people in medieval Europe thought the earth was flat. Even had a history prof in college repeat this (granted she was an American history prof, so 🤷‍♂️. Makes the modern flat Earth movement even more perplexing.

My favorite bit of evidence for this is in Dante's Purgatorio. He opens several cantos by mentioning where the sun is in the sky at different points on the globe at a given time, in Rome, India, and the island of Purgatory, which he puts antipodal to Jerusalem, so halfway between Chile and New Zealand.

The whole bit about Columbus proving it was round is bogus. He thought the earth was smaller than it actually was, which is why he said he could hit the East Indies before dying of starvation by sailing west. Lucky for him there was a whole other continent in the way. Could you imagine traversing the Atlantic, the entire breadth of North America, and the Pacific?

that I actually give a fuck.

I don't.

Potentially triggering, beware: belief is something reserved for everything outside of the material and observable, like the afterlife, God and values. Often people want material "evidence" as a prerequisite for belief but it just doesn't work that way, there's no necessary material connection between that and belief. Ofc, belief that cannot conform to one's reason and understanding will never stand for long, but it has nothing to do with the world perceived by the senses, that's what all scientific fields and tools are for!

When I say many people here/in the West don't understand the nature of belief, that's what I mean. They don't stand for anything, they just accept the world through their senses and in the absence of values (again, belief), they can only default to consumerism and hedonism (because the senses say they feel good and that's all one can "know" in the absence of belief).

Faith is the belief in something without evidence, or in the face of contradictory evidence

It's choosing to believe without good reason

I'm never going to respect that.

To say that people have no values because they're not part of some superstitious nonsense says a lot about you, as does your straw man of "consumerism and hedonism"

Like I said, if it goes against your understanding you'll never truly believe it, not for long at least. It's not choosing to believe with no "good reason", it's choosing to believe despite there being no relation at all between matters of fact (ascertained by the senses) and that. Check out Hume's fork, it's kinda like that. God is not in this world, God is necessarily outside of it and of a different nature (we're data for God the programmer, we're his free-willed Sims and the universe is a sandbox) so you can't find Him here, through our senses, and added to that are the classical fork interdictions (e.g., moral statements cannot derive from matters of fact, one can simply not care).

And if you have some somewhat prosocial if not completely developed set of moral standards, well that's great, I'm happy! Men are made good after all, hence the propaganda needed to turn one against each other.

"Belief" and "values" are not synonymous and not dependant upon one another.

Values are a subset of things one can believe in.

I like that answer.