If tomorrow I do sets of 3 reps of 85% of my 1-rep max with 5 minute rests (as many sets as possible), what info will my number of sets tell me? Or is an entirely useless benchmark to track?
11d 5h ago by lemmy.world/u/alliwantsoda in fitness
(Age 40, male, 260 pounds, seated dumbbell shoulder press, lifting diligently for just under a year)
I am taking a rest day today because I have way too much systemic fatigue apparently. I have been doing seated shoulder presses almost daily for triples (sets of 3 reps) all year, typically for 1-2 sets but occasionally more. It's my favorite exercise and it's the only lift I actively work towards getting stronger at. (my other lifts have gone up some but less as a percentage) Here is my workout from yesterday and all previous workouts this month follow a similar volume:
Jun 5th 2pm
Shoulder Press DB
- 3 reps x 55lbs
- 3 reps x 55lbs
Close-Grip Incline Bench Press
- 5 reps x 115lbs
- 5 reps x 115lbs
(45 minute mcdo break)
Shoulder Press DB
- 3 reps x 55lbs
Close-Grip Cable Row
- 3 reps x 187lbs
EZ-Bar Curls
- 2 reps x 100lbs
10 minute rests, moderate glycogen levels estimated
6pm 2 sets of 45lb kettlebell swings for 15 seconds each
7pm 40 minutes of zone-2 cardio
My 1-rep max early last month was with the 60-pound dumbbells but I only achieved that once in my life, and I've failed to get 60 pounds twice since then, so I'm estimating that my true 1-rep max is closer to 58.8 pounds, of which taking 85% yields 50 pounds.
Yesterday I was able to successfully perform 2 triples (2 sets of 3 reps) with the 55-pound dumbbells with a 10 minute break in between, which was the first time I've been able to accomplish that. Prior to yesterday, I could only get 2 reps on my 2nd set following a 10 minute rest using the 55-pound dumbbells. I absolutely would not have been able to do a 3rd set of 3 reps with the same weight yesterday after another 10 minute break because it mentally crippled me and I felt useless all day yesterday after my morning gym session, which is why I'm taking a rest day today.
Tomorrow, my goal is to be able to get at least 10 triples (10 sets of 3 reps) using the 50 pound dumbbells but hoping for 20 or 30 sets of 3 reps since the 50 pound dumbbells feel very light/easy in comparison to the 55 pound dumbbells. However, I've never done more than 4 sets per day of the same exercise so my goal might be unrealistic. It's just what I want to do tomorrow, which is my reason for posting.
TL;DR: If tomorrow I do sets of 3 reps of 85% of my 1-rep max with 5 minute rests (as many sets as possible), what info will my number of sets tell me about my strength endurance or my conditioning or my physiology? Or is an entirely useless benchmark to track?
It's not deeply insightful imo beyond telling you what you're doing now compared to what you've done before. Are you doing more than before? If so, good, that's supposed to happen. If not, why?
And also it will tell you that there are some people who are stronger than you (at least in that lift) and some people you are stronger than (at least in that lift). Which is always the case.
Question for you: I rarely see or hear about people doing 3 rep max or 1 rep max with dumbells, usually that is a barbell thing? Why aren't you doing more like the 6-12 rep range?
Also, there's a good reason it is not recommended to do heavy compound lifts every day, like you said you've been doing. Has that worked well for you? You will probably advance more quickly by lifting less frequently! Rest/recovery is just as important as the lift, as it's where the muscle actually grows and gets stronger.
It’s not deeply insightful imo beyond telling you what you’re doing now compared to what you’ve done before. Are you doing more than before? If so, good, that’s supposed to happen. If not, why?
Yes. In December I could not lift the 50 pound dumbbells for 1 rep. I could only get 45 pound dumbbells for 4 reps and failed with the 50 pounders.
Question for you: I rarely see or hear about people doing 3 rep max or 1 rep max with dumbells, usually that is a barbell thing? Why aren’t you doing more like the 6-12 rep range?
My favorite fitness youtuber last year was "Flow High Performance" and I believed his advice (and 90% of other fitness youtubers) emphasizing the RIR advice that essentially says to make sure all your working sets are limited to 3 or fewer reps in reserve. I stumbled across a different concept (the greasing the groove protocol) and I tested it experimentally and had superior results compared to my workouts last year. Here's a playlist of 9 videos I put together and the linked video summarizes it pretty well (i.e. that "less is more"): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WtU66OYkJIE&list=PLCh9kW9pX73Z9O4ya7PVfId9XOUQZ-_a5&index=2
The main reason though is because I like it. I love going to the gym and doing 15 seconds of high-intensity effort (sets of 3) and then resting for 10 minutes by setting a timer, logging my exercise, figuring out which exercise I want to do next, looking at my exercises the past 3 days to see if a muscle group hasn't been targeted, etc...
I love the ratio of 15 seconds to 600 seconds of work/rest. It fits my personality and my preferences and is the setup I find most enjoyable. But it also seemingly works better than the most recommended method by youtubers such as Jeff Nippard, Mike Israetel, etc..
Also, there’s a good reason it is not recommended to do heavy compound lifts every day, like you said you’ve been doing. Has that worked well for you? You will probably advance more quickly by lifting less frequently! Rest/recovery is just as important as the lift, as it’s where the muscle actually grows and gets stronger.
Fully agreed! I'm still a beginner and I'm trying to learn how much each exercise contributes to neural or systemic fatigue as that's my limiting factor. I was somewhat "forced" near the end of last month to take 4 days off from the gym due to life responsibilities, and it made me realize I was severely under-resting and neglecting my recovery by a huge margin. I was looking at my average daily volume of 10-20 reps and believed it was extremely low compared to other programs I've looked at (such as Jeff Nippard's 7 day split of Push, Pull, Legs, rest, upper, lower, rest) and I thought doing 3-6 working sets per day would never give me more fatigue than I could recover from by the next day. Suffice to say, I was very very wrong. 🤦♂️
Wait, in your original post you are saying 3 reps, and 3 rep max, and now you are using reps in reserve (RIR) which is different
(from my OP) My favorite fitness youtuber last year was “Flow High Performance” and I believed his advice (and 90% of other fitness youtubers) emphasizing the RIR advice that essentially says to make sure all your working sets are limited to 3 or fewer reps in reserve.
I apologize for the poor communication. I was a fan of the RIR advice last year but not this year. My wording was terrible and I should have been more clear.
I am now a fan of the "Grease the Groove" technique/advice which says to do a heavy percentage of your 1-rep max but only do fewer reps with much longer rest times. Pavel says to do 3 reps of whatever weight represents your 6-rep-max but other youtubers have slightly different recommendations for calculating how much weight to use and how many reps.
Technically I'm no longer following the "grease the groove" when I switched from 50 to 55 pound dumbbells but I felt the 50 pound dumbbells were too easy and I was compensating by doing multiple sets, which I feared may have been contributing to my systemic and/or neural fatigue, which is my current bottleneck that I must figure out a solution to.
However after writing this, I now realize I am doing multiple sets per day with the 55 pound dumbbells which I promised myself I wouldn't do, thus negating the initial reason for switching from 50 to 55 pound dumbbells. 🤦♂️
Just so we're in the same page, 3 reps in reserve (RIR) does not mean sets of 3 or less, or lock you into super low reps. What it does mean is that reach set you do goes sufficiently close to failure, as in if you did a set of 8 with 3 RIR, that means you did 8 and with the best possible effort, you could squeeze out another 3 reps. I keep most of my sets at 1 RIR, and the last set is 0 RIR, which means I either go to complete failure, or stopped on the rep before I couldn't physically lift the weight one more time.
With all that being said, you can do sets of 3 with 3 RIR, or 20-30 with 3 RIR. Just make sure you're pushing close to failure.
Understood. I had written a draft 1-2 months ago (that was eaten by my browser and I lost it) and was going to make a post about RIR because I've slowly lost faith in that idea. Here was a reddit screenshot I planned to include in the post: 
https://i.imgur.com/R2sf6pO.png(posting twice in case one version is unreadable)
In summary, the 1 line from this person's reddit screenshot that summarizes perfectly what I believe about RIR is that "it has way too much to do with one's personality" and I would also add that I believe it has to do with someone's preparation. I spend a massive amount of effort in life ensuring that each day at the gym, I am brimming with energy similarly to this guy right before his Zercher deadlift: https://youtu.be/BAb4TRPVo8w?t=11
I respect the idea of the RIR and I believe it has value and usefulness, but I also believe it arbitrarily shifts locus of control away from the person and gives the person an excuse at the gym to arrive less prepared to the gym. Lastly, it diminishes those with an inherent (or cultivated) extremely strong "David Goggins" style of personality who have massively greater ability to "recruit effort" from the brain before/during the brain's recruitment of motor units.
Furthermore, I believe that the Grease-The-Groove protocol indirectly teaches a person to get better at recruiting effort and sharpening their personality to be more like peak David Goggins. I could be wrong though, I'm still just a beginner but one who has tremendous fascination with the physiology & neurology involved with peak strength and/or peak gym performance.